Matthewson (Automatic Sports Co.) games

American, British, French or German? We want to know about it.
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badpenny
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Automatic Sports Company machines

Post by badpenny »

Hi Tom Arcade and welcome to the forum.

Wowsers you've certainly come knocking with a bit of a gem.
I've never seen one .....
1358404318-Golf.png-original.jpg.png

If anyone has one it wouldn't surprise me, but they've kept it quiet, so best of luck.
I found this on YouTube, and found it quite amusing. It looks like something from a Monty Python sketch.



ETA This one sounds like yours? If so the estimate was a bit wide of the mark wasn't it?
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by coppinpr »

Well here is a rarity. I've never seen one either! Closest I've been is the football variation we had for sale at the last Coventry auction. Finding parts and even advice might be hard for this one
http://www.mechanicalmemoriesmagazine.c ... 4588485945

We commented on the hand knitted jerseys on the football machine, well there they are again. What a machine!

The other machines made by Automatic Sports Co. were Yacht racer, Shooting Big Game, Marksman, Cricket, and a six man version of the football game. I think the last was Big Game in 1912.

The Cricket machine
The Cricket machine
cricket machine.jpg (6.64 KiB) Viewed 3576 times

tom arcade
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by tom arcade »

Thanks for the nice comments on the machine. It has a tremendous presence but a proper stand would make it even more of a standout. I know parts, stand, etc may be impossible to find but I have had some strange luck on some US machines so I figure it is worth asking.

Yes, the machine pictured on the you tube video is the one I bought. I had never seen the golf version before, but was aware of the football by ASC. Once I saw it available in the auction, I had a dilemma: who to ask about the machine and how much is it worth without tipping anyone off to the machine. The auction house mainly sells furniture, paintings,etc and this was the only coin operated machine they have sold. So I was hoping not many people saw it. The auction was only 4 hours from where I live but as luck would have it, I had a coin op trip scheduled - the annual COCA convention in California. I got set up for phone bidding and literally was bidding at the home of a collector who has a huge arcade in his home. I had to step outside as all the machines playing made it difficult to hear.

As far as the comment about exceeding the auctioneer estimate, I knew the machine had to be quite valuable. I did not want to ask in my initial post, but any information as to past sale prices of other machines by ASC (cricket, golf, football) would be appreciated. Any guesses as to how many survivors there are of these great machines would be welcome also?

The history of this machine is that it was found in the attic of golf country club in Michigan in the '70s. If you can believe this, no one wanted it and one woman said she would take it as her mom collected antiques. It has been with that family ever since.

Looking closer at the football machine, I see that the marquee states that your coin is returned when a goal is scored. The golf machine marquee states that the coin is returned when a ball goes in hole 3. I tried some steel balls and put in hole 3, but do not know how the coin would be returned. I see the coin return slot, but do not know how this would mechanically happen. Perhaps someone with a football machine could shed some light on this.\n Thanks in advance for any help and information on this machine.

Tom.
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by gameswat »

Tom, once this was advertised online the whole world knew it was up for auction. I wasn't looking or in the market but was told well beforehand through the collector network. I mentioned to a local friend who decided to bid just in case it went reasonably due to the missing base and other issues, but quickly doubled his max. And a terrible exchange rate right now for Aussies to buy overseas. The big issue is re-casting that hollow base, which is a lot of work for an expert in foundry pattern making.

The original marquees for these machines were much smaller and ornate to match the cases. The tall cast marquees on both the Football and Golf machines with figures either side were much later additions, presumably by Rowland when he took over operating the machines in the 1920s or '30s. They always seem to contain the Rowland enamel instruction plates. I find the style of those marquee and lettering very modern when compared to the rest of the Victorian case.
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mathewson 6 man football.jpg
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john t peterson
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by john t peterson »

Tom,

Welcome to the best site going for assistance on that great golf machine. I've not seen one before but the style of the game (shooting a ball into a hole and getting a coin back in reward) is identical to the "Cricket" by the same manufacturer. As a member of COCA, you have access to many knowledgeable members in the US. One in particular, an advanced collector in Pasadena, California (maybe you saw his collection?) has one or more of the Cricket games. He's quite approachable and if willing, could help you with the issues of the size of the balls necessary for play as well as the mechanism.

Good luck and keep us apprised!

And welcome aboard.

John Peterson
Fellow American collector of British whimsy !!USA!!
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by bob »

I beg to differ with my compatriot Rory/Gameswat. Whilst the tall marquees for the Matthewson Football machines are a later addition, possibly by Rowlandson, I believe that the Golf machine had the tall marquee from the very start.
This is rather difficult to prove conclusively as there is no separate patent for the Golf machine as it is based on the football patent.However, I have never come across a Golf machine that did not have the tall marquee, either here in Australia or elsewhere. Similarly in my quite large collection of postcards showing coin op machines on location on British piers etc., all the Golf machines have the tall marquees in the very early 1900's, alongside the Matthewson Football machines with their smaller marquees.
I agree that the tall Football marquee does not have the style and charm of the original marquees but feel that Golf marquee does have some of the style and care that the original marquees on the Football machines have. There is also a tall marquee for the six man footballer that I have only ever seen one illustration of which does attempt a bit more style.
Interestingly the Golf marquee has two figures which I have also thought were based on the appearance of Matthewson himself and look very early 1900's in appearance and fashion unlike the tall Football marquees.
I will also attach an advertisement by Arnold and Sons for Matthewson Sports machines which comes from a Bolland scrapbook that John Gresham had. Braithwaite lists the Arnold machines as having appeared in 1922. I have never come across the Cricket or Football machines illustrated here which appear to be in wooden cabinets with different marquees again. Interestingly the Golf machine unlike the other two is in its original form with the tall marquee.
Has any reader here ever sighted any of these "Arnold/Matthewson" machines or found reference to them anywhere else?
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Matthewson Golf Close Up.jpg
Matthewson Golf Close Up.jpg (26.23 KiB) Viewed 3277 times
Matthewson Football Match.jpg
Matthewson Football Match.jpg (25.03 KiB) Viewed 3277 times
Matthewson 3 Sports machines Arnold & Sons ad507.jpg
Matthewson506.jpg
Matthewson Football Tall Marquee 1.jpg
Matthewson Football Tall Marquee 2.jpg
Last edited by bob on Wed Sep 09, 2015 12:04 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by gameswat »

Great info Bob! I agree the Golf has a much more integrated marquee and the other Football marquees you show in the old photo and advert are a better fit than the very modern looking example. But in phone conversation you stated a much later production date for the Golf than in most if not all the books, making it well and truly not a Victorian machine with a date of 1912 or so? Strange they didn't maker a unique golf themed case to match the game? I can believe a date like that for the Golf marquee but the Victorian frilly cases were looking dated even by then so could it be these Golf machines were revamped cases from an over-supply of Football machines? The same way they recycled Mermaid Yacht Race cases into pistol games? I've always found the pistols on top of a naked woman to be a strange mix for sure! The castle style bases they made for shooting games were a much better fit.
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by bob »

When I spoke with you on the phone Rory I wasn't sure of the Golf machine date but wrongly thought that it was quite a bit later than the football. When I checked today I found that the actual dates are not that far apart. 1899 for the two man footballer and 1903 for both the six man footballer and the golf machine, as you've already found from the patents and Braithwaite etc. I also have dated postcards of the Football and Golf machines side by side on location just after the turn of the century with the Golf having the tall marquee.
I doubt the Golf machines used recycled Football machine cases as they came out at the same time as the six man footballer. The mermaid cased gun machines did not use surplus recycled Yacht race cases, they were Yacht race games brought back from location and converted to gun machines as the Yacht race games were not profitable. They took so long to play that they were not popular and did not make as much money as a quick gun game. This is why there is only one Yacht Race remaining world wide as it came to Australia before they were converted in the UK.
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Yacht Race.jpg
Yacht Race.jpg (22.38 KiB) Viewed 3716 times
Yacht Race Close Up.jpg
Yacht Race Close Up.jpg (21.16 KiB) Viewed 3716 times
Last edited by bob on Tue Sep 08, 2015 2:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by gameswat »

I certainly didn't mean to imply there were NOS cases of any kind sitting around the Mathewson factory!
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by pennymachines »

Welcome Tom to PennyMachines.co.uk and congratulations on your splendid purchase!

I believe at least two of our members here have Sport Co. Golfers, but in view of the machine's value, might understandably shy away from identifying themselves. Perhaps you'll be contacted by PM or email though. Further to the fascinating input from Bob and Gameswat, all I can offer is a larger version of the old Bolland photo Bob posted, and another picture which Bryan's Fan gave me yesterday (from a Bolland negative, I think).
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by gameswat »

Tom, from the photos and machine history it looks like it was probably converted to take a nickel? If so, possibly the coin return was removed as it wasn't an easy conversion? I've seen this happen a bit on English/Euro machines in the States. I have done very minor work on one of these Golf machines but was over 10 years ago and not my machine, so little memory of how it worked and I never bothered to take any photos sadly. The back door is just a flat steel plate so easy enough to make. Though to do it justice would be nice to find some antique steel which will have a rough surface where it was hand rolled in a press I guess? I'll bet those men are loose after over 100 years of putting! Games like these always get extra thrashing too because kids will endlessly pull levers to see movement without having to spend any money. Seems doubtful the machine has ever been properly restored, just repaired by operators. So at some point when you have the time and commitment you'll need to pull the whole thing apart on a bench and look closely at every single piece. That's the only way to truly find out which bolts, shafts, wires, rods etc are worn and need repair or replacement, and what is ok. I have to do this even on electro-mech machines that are only 30 + years old, so the Golf will definitely need the attention to get it back to "chip shot shape". Say that ten times quickly!
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Re: Automatic Sports Company Golf machine help needed

Post by sweetmeats »

The machine you have is extremely rare and think you brought it very cheaply even without a stand, I know of only two others in the states one came from Australia and one from England also there are still two in England if there are still any in Australia Bob would know. As a member of COCA I suggest that you ask other collectors as I know a member has one I saw it on a COCA visit to Boston he did not what it was however I told him it was from a British machine [ thinking of the football machine] and would be worth at least $5000 to anyone who had a top and wanted a stand. For a golfer would be worth $10,000 the last time one sold complete was over $50,000 . Going onto the thread of the shooters I understood the mermaids were converted on site to shooters and operated by Matherson I have never seen a castle/lighthouse on any postcard on site however if examined closely the only alteration from the mermaid top is the small shell to the top is replaced by a small battlement the seaweed design to the top remain as does the fish coin entry
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Re: Morphy Auctions Coin-Op & Advertising, May 14-15

Post by bob »

Topic split from Morphy Auctions Coin-Op & Advertising, May 14-15 and merged - Site Admin.

I imagine the high estimate and amazing result for the Mermaid Artillery Duel machine was due in part to the previous sale for a Mermaid gun machine in 2010 as reported here.
This was a single gun machine housed in a mermaid cabinet. There was also a game called Shooting Big Game using a Matthewson Mermaid cabinet, or a cabinet that has been variously described as a fort or castle or lighthouse type. Some had a “fort” type top and some retained the seashell at the top of the cabinet. They may have been Matthewson or Bolland conversions. It may have been that the lighthouse type cabinet was originally designed for locations where the bare breasted mermaid was not deemed suitable, or possibly when the Yacht Race machines were converted to gun games.

Shooting Big Game
Shooting Big Game


Shooting Big Game
Shooting Big Game

Matthewson patented the Yacht Race game mechanism in 1900, patent no. 19,812 and patented the Mermaid cabinet in 1902, design patent no. 399522. The design patent for the lighthouse fort type may exist somewhere around this period but I did not search for it at time. It would probably not be that difficult for someone in the UK to find it now, if such a design patent actually exists, but when I searched for the Matthewson design patent by phone from here at the British Patent Office many years ago it was both difficult and costly for me. Finding Matthewson’s mermaid cabinet design patents did however disprove the tale that these were converted aquariums, a rather unlikely story that Bolland had told Jon Gresham and other collectors and researchers and thus became accepted as fact.

Matthewson Yacht Race Design Patent
Matthewson Yacht Race Design Patent

Matthewson only patented one gun game mechanism, the two player Artillery Duel in 1912 patent no. 8005. This would probably have been when he took all the Yacht Races off location and converted them to gun games. By that time the Mermaid Yacht Race would most likely have already found its way to Australia and remained intact as a Yacht Race game.

I am attaching a photo of The Artillery Duel with a pistol grip as in Matthewson’s mechanism patent and also one with pistol grip type trigger mechanisms with a Bolland Direction plate. Both games have a “fort” type top. I am also attaching two photos of Shooting Big Game machines which is another single gun game that was used in these cabinets. Interestingly, one of them has a “fort” type top whereas the other had a shell type top. These photos came from a friend in the UK who did quite a lot of research on the Matthewson machines many years ago, so I am not sure of all the details of the origin of these photos any more.

The Artillery Duel
The Artillery Duel


Matthewson - Bolland The Artillery Duel
Matthewson - Bolland The Artillery Duel

I’ll also attach a photo of the Artillery Duel sold at auction in 2010 and one sold at an auction by Phillip’s in London 1992 for 13,500 pounds including buyer’s premium etc.

Mermaid Marksman War Game
Mermaid Marksman War Game
Matthewson Mermaid Marksman War Game02.jpg (25.05 KiB) Viewed 3706 times


Artillery Duel in Fort Case
Artillery Duel in Fort Case

Many years ago, I found an identical Mermaid base made of zinc in an antique shop in Sassafras, a country village about an hour’s drive from Melbourne for sale for about $1,000 (500 pounds). This was made of zinc as used in some of the coin of vending machines, like the Leoni French hen and the Bamboula cigar vending machine in the Morphy auction last weekend. This was a common French manufacturing technique that for some reason was not employed in Germany or the UK. The owner of the antique shop was a Belgian who imported most of his stock for the shop in containers from Belgium. The next time I visited the shop the stand was gone, sold to a local lady as a flower stand. Sadly, I never did get a chance to speak to the shop owner to inquire about its origins before the shop disappeared, nor was I able to get a photo of it - just another mystery related to the Matthewson machines.
Last edited by bob on Fri May 20, 2016 12:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Morphy Auctions Coin-Op & Advertising, May 14-15

Post by bryans fan »

What a mine of information you are Bob, well done, great post! !WORSHIPFULL!
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Re: Automatic Sports Company games

Post by pennymachines »

Thanks Bob for all that great info. I've now stitched a bunch of these Automatic Sports Co. threads together to make them easier to navigate.
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Re: Automatic Sports Company games

Post by bryans fan »

By coincidence I recently obtained this photo.
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