Advice and guidance on repair and restoration techniques.
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badpenny
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How fast can you back pedal?

Postby badpenny » Wed Mar 28, 2018 9:02 pm

Let me ask a question.
If somebody came on here saying that they had a machine that was running rough, ie .....
Unpredictably
Slowly
Sometimes not completing its cycle

Wouldn't we ask them if it'd always behaved like that and then tell them of the evils of dried grease?
I for one have being trotting out that one for years now, along with how to degrease it and to use light oil except where coins come into contact.

So guess what I did when I decided to tackle a Clement & Whales Greyhound Stadium that was spinning slowly and not always getting to the end of the cycle especially on the higher pay outs? Naturally I gazed knowingly at the triple ply layer of hard grease that coated 80% of the moving parts and advised myself to lay the whole mech on its back in a basin and pour in diesel & paraffin until everything but the dial was covered.
Two days later I removed a sparkling mechanism from a swamp that could have easily supported a spoon upright.

Happy days? ...... errr, no not really.
It transpires that it was only the grease that was holding everything more or less in line as well as taking up the slack in the wear between parts that needed to be exactly so far apart.
Who would have thought that the groove carved in the solidified grease by the pin holding two links together was the only thing allowing the last part of the cycle to: -
Release the handle to return
Fire the pay out fingers
Dictate how many slides released ???????????

What were the chances of a previously working Clock to suddenly have such loose bearings that not a single axle was running true leaving the teeth on the cogs trying to run high point to high point. They were so skew whiff two were hardly perpendicular now the grease was removed.

So far six interactions between levers that need to shove each other at the right time are anything up to 1/4 inch adrift, forget thou!

Outcome? I'm now learning new skills like ....
Clock making ... gear cog .... lathe
Re forming bearings with solder
Building up worn gaps between partner levers that need to interface closely.

So what's the answer? ..... I haven't a clue, what I do know is I've been guilty of mending something until it's really broken.

BP ..... Now starting to understand the difference between 35 years experience as a slot restorer and one year's experience 35 times ..... Gulp! !!UHOH!!

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clubconsoles
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby clubconsoles » Wed Mar 28, 2018 9:59 pm

That's a great story but a lesson learned, I guess. :oops:
Who would have thought that the dried out grease had effectively turned into pseudo metal and kept those moving parts correctly aligned!! :dammit:
Nigel

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treefrog
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby treefrog » Sat Mar 31, 2018 8:43 am

Similar issues have happened to me when removing piles of old grease, especially finding badly word or broken parts I was not aware of. I suspect there are many who have gone to repair something only to make it worse, not better.

Gonna see what’s under this lot. I started yesterday, only positive thing being an Aristocrat probably as it was when it left the factory. :D It is one of the worst ones I have had to deal with for a while. Must be two tins of heavy grease on everything including fingers, reels etc. and it still works perfectly before removing the stuff... Maybe a lesson to learn here and should have left alone, just looks terrible.
D3531A7C-FCDC-4AF7-B772-430D90E34039a.jpg

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badpenny
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby badpenny » Sat Mar 31, 2018 11:11 am

I wouldn't worry there TF, as you say Aristos and Jubs are case hardened ....... except for the chrome.

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badpenny
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby badpenny » Mon Apr 09, 2018 2:50 pm

Well that was a fun project and no mistook.
I didn't have to learn clock making arts to get the gears in the clock to mesh.
By shortening the pillars that hold the two plates of the clock apart it brought different less worn areas of the teeth to come into play.

Next I had to address the lateral slack in a couple of levers that were twisting before moving in their supposed direction which were effecting the payout
I did this by sleeving a couple of the axles to oversize them and then drilling out the corresponding holes to the same size.

The main spring that pulls the clock and winds down the cycle was a tad weak. I'm sure we've all come across this problem at some time. What options are open?
You don't have the perfect replacement
You have one the right size to fit, but it doesn't have the strength.
You have one that's strong enough but is too short and you stand to lose skin, blood, finger nails and patience trying to pull it into place.
So, I tried a new (for me) idea. I put it on the mech and then shortened its stretch by looping a pair of nylon zip ties around 3 of the loops, opposite each other.
IMG_2749.JPG
Success!!
I also removed a pair of bugs a previous operator had placed on the highest wins.
It now spins until the brake comes in.
All coins placed smoothly release to the pay out tube on the next play.
All of the pay outs work.
The handle resets every time and without jerking up at the end.
And I suppose what's really nice yet most intangible is that it runs so smoothly, almost like a sewing machine.
The back bonnet locks as do the back door and cash box.

So far I've put a couple of hundred coins through it without concern, I'll probably shove another hundred in before I feel happily confident.


This is the second one of these I've done a total strip down on, so if anyone has questions and I can help, just shout.
BP
caille2a.jpg
IMG_2751a.jpg
thumbnail_WP_20180308_16_41_28_Pro[1].jpg

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treefrog
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby treefrog » Sat Oct 24, 2020 9:50 am

Just finished my first commercial rebuild, bugger what a job. Cabinet needed a completed rebuild as worm/damp damage and the mechanism was rusted solid and real tough to get sorted. Was inspired by one of our colleagues work on sorting the veneer he did on his on youtube and your comments on the mechanism. Still a lot of fun....

Yes I know the coin cup and handle should not be black paint, but chrome plate was shot, so maybe if I ever get something sent the players I can add these...

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bryans fan
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby bryans fan » Sat Oct 24, 2020 12:48 pm

!!THUMBSX2!! CoNgRaTs !!GOODJOB!!

Great stuff! Excellent work.

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arrgee
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby arrgee » Tue Oct 27, 2020 8:36 pm

Well done TF, that looked quite a basket case, always amazes me how much skill there is by many members on this site. !!THUMBSX2!!

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treefrog
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby treefrog » Tue Oct 27, 2020 9:16 pm

Not sure I have any skills, just determined to finish jobs I started. Already halfway through next a machine posted 6 years ago under another thread that had the worst worm I have ever seen. I treated at the time and parked like most projects. So started and thought I could save the front and maybe graft good wood at the bottom, but the worm have eaten every part of the inside of the panels, leaving the exterior veneer holding it all together...
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So given the front is ply and internal cashbox and baseplate, decided to replace these and the base of the machine which was rotten. I know it is sacrilege, but I have chopped up a Mills Extraordinary cabinet for a new base :shock: and made new fronts, cashbox and baseplate.
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Also worked out how to make my own keys on traditional locks without changing the lock, so now have cashbox and backdoor with working keys. I was lucky to buy a load of original Yale keys a while back. Hopefully will get finished by end of the week |/XX\|
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santelmann
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Re: How fast can you back pedal?

Postby santelmann » Wed Oct 28, 2020 10:04 am

Excellent work, TF! !!THUMBSX2!!

Witch type of filler and what kind of glue (for fixing veneer) did you use on the Caille project?
What thickness have the veneer?


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