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coppinpr
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Re: Firmans

Postby coppinpr » Sat Feb 23, 2019 1:36 pm

One thing to take into account, we have not seen the insides of your machine. It could have a ten stop mech but with 20 stop reel strips. This means it will always stop quite sharply as there are only 10 stops on the reels. Might be worth counting the number of gaps on one of the reels just so we know what's going on.

tammy
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Re: Firmans

Postby tammy » Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:30 pm

Aw, you might be right. I think the last owner sent me a picture on this thread... If it was, and unless he used a different mechanism, the picture shows a 10 stop. The trouble is the before picture shows broken wood at the front of cabinet. I am a little confused, so tomorrow will try do some mech pictures. It's almost like a Time Team Special as it unfolds!!

tammy
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Re: Firmans

Postby tammy » Sun Feb 24, 2019 10:59 am

Hi coppinpr, I enclose mech photos and look forward to your comments. tammy
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coppinpr
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Re: Firmans

Postby coppinpr » Sun Feb 24, 2019 4:20 pm

Ok, well definitely 10 stop then. So unless you have much a rarer mech that alternates between the two sets of symbols (can't see in the photos, but unlikely), ten of the symbols on each reel are never coming up. (Even if you do have the alternating system, it still only has ten stops). 10 stop mechs tend to much more clunky and sudden. You will see that the star wheels on each reel have the 10 stops and the reel lock slots on the payout discs also have 10 stops. It may well be that the reels are spinning too fast (usually it's just the opposite) and the reel brakes will make a big difference. My guess is the reel brakes were added on the original 10 stop mechs because they needed them. The reason so many get removed and never replaced is that 20 stop machines don't really need them as much. The 10s do seem to bounce sometimes, but it would have to bounce a total of three symbols to make a difference, as the symbols each side of the actual stopping place can never come up. For example, if there were orange-bell-plum-bar-cherry and the game ended on a plum, it would need to bounce to an orange or a cherry to make a difference, as it could never settle on the bell or bar. Is your machine making that big a bounce? If so, I think the reel brakes will sort the problem out.

tammy
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Re: Firmans

Postby tammy » Sun Feb 24, 2019 6:10 pm

Thank you coppinpr for your expertise, it is and has been much valued! I will put the brake stop adjustments on it and live with the fact it's only a 10 stop but should be a 20 stop for the reel strips it has on it!!.. I thought it was funny how it doesn't seem to get many winning lines and so doesn't pay out much!.. It doesn't have the right reel symbols for a 10 stop mech, as you rightly pointed out. Still it's a lovely looking machine so I will enjoy it and hopefully find an old 20 stop mech to buy. If anyone not too far from East Yorkshire has a cheapish one, then let me know. I am a purist as some say as I don't like new shiny reel strips but like the original ones from the past arcade days! I bought a nice set of really old reel strips a while ago and was going to put them on this bandit when I decided to buy it. However with your good advice and knowledge I will keep them till I have a 20 stop mech for them.
Regards tammy

tammy
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Re: Firmans

Postby tammy » Sun Feb 24, 2019 7:14 pm

Hi Freddy,
I found 5 token like coins inside an original 1930s Roman Head Bandit wrapped in old yellowed newspaper in a side display window. It was back in 1972. The coins have serrated edges and are coin like and old penny size too. At first look I thought they were gold... but evidently gilt or coated.
I still have the 3 coins/tokens 47 years on and I think no one on the site seems to know what they are. I feel with all your earlier years of knowledge you might? They appear too well made. Were they made as early gold award tokens for Mills machines? I would be interested in what you think.
I had to use an earlier picture I used last time I asked on the forum. I have put the coin tokens away but if the quality of the pivtures is too poor I will dig them out next week as they look so much better than in this photo!
Thank you in anticipation! tammy
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coppinpr
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Re: Firmans

Postby coppinpr » Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:32 pm

the fact it's only a 10 stop but should be a 20 stop for the reel strips it has on it!!.
Definitely NOT the case, although your reel strips may not be the original strips. 20 stop strips are most likely correct. In the early days, which this machine represents, Mills fitted 20 symbol strips to 10 stop machines to make it look like there were more options in the "just missed it by one" vane when there was of course never the chance of getting that close by winner. I believe this idea was soon outlawed in the USA but refurbishers in the UK loved it increasing the profits for operators. I very much recommend keeping the rarer strips the machine has now. This was how it was designed to run and represents an interesting talking point when showing off your machine.

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treefrog
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Re: Firmans

Postby treefrog » Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:49 pm

Unless I have misunderstood Widget, the machine in its previous state is on the previous page and on the first page from 6 years ago. Had number strips enlarged for 10 stop. Numbers were commonly used either in the large for or with 20 stop variants on 10 stop mechs.....suspect the strips have been changed these fortune ones.... Also top marquee seems to have gone.

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brigham
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Re: Firmans

Postby brigham » Mon Feb 25, 2019 11:00 am

Numbers instead of fruit were generally a British idea; the fruit symbols still carried a whiff of 'organized crime' in the 1940s and '50s.
The legal status of these machines was questionable in Britain, and dealers such as Tom Boland tried to minimise the 'dodgy' aspects such as the 10 stop/20 symbol device, by making the numbers large enough to fill the whole window.
Boland did produce a set of fruit symbols to fill the window on 10-stop mechs, but they were, and are, very rarely seen. They have a resemblance to the German style found on Beromat-type wall machines.

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coppinpr
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Re: Firmans

Postby coppinpr » Mon Feb 25, 2019 3:35 pm

I agree that when Firmans released the machine on the public it probably had the usual UK numbers in double size so it could be said the 10 stop numbers are original but I'll bet you the old mech started life in the USA with twenty stop strips on the 10 stop mech and it didn't have numbers for sure. I hate the numbers, they make the game less interesting.


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