Komonsteve horse race help

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thunder
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Komonsteve horse race help

Post by thunder »

Had this part machine for a while. Looks like coin slot releases balls that ran along track left and right side then through hole down track and nudge a horse. I have no case and would appreciate info on what it looks like. I have a horse on a bar that ran in a narrow track. I don't have the part that was in the track. Any help on this? It would be good to see it up and running, if it's worth doing?
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coppinpr
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Re: Komon Steve horse race help

Post by coppinpr »

I've seen something like this before, not coin operated I believe. It's a very interesting bagatelle type game. You're missing the case with the ball push and the ball run up the right side. The balls shoot up the side and randomly fall into different holes moving the relevant horse forward. Part of a 1930s craze for home gambling in a small way. Yours would seem to be an arcade model. Well worth restoring.
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Re: Komon Steve horse race help

Post by thunder »

This has a hinged bar on the left and right side which lifts so you can control ball speed, not the sprung type. Would it be a table top machine or on legs would you think?
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Re: Komon Steve horse race help

Post by coppinpr »

I'm only guessing because it's so hard to see (more photos please), but I still think your machine had a ball launcher (or a very short billiard cue of about 18" was sometimes used). I think the ball controllers were an attempt to add a skill factor to the ball return.
Pace made a much more advanced machine but still in the same mode as yours. See it at: http://pacificpinball.org/component/content/article/72

No legs I think, as I suspect it was table top or, more likely, bar top, as I see this machine as a small time betting machine in a bar with the bar taking the operating coins as profit.
This could be very rare I think.
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Re: Komon Steve horse race help

Post by gameswat »

Just did a Google search of the name and came up with this interesting bit of info from a 1943 Billboard magazine about high used machine prices in England. komonsteve

And I was interested to see a little lower in the list of games the name Pleasure Island, which is the super rare export version of the 1934 Rockola Worlds series pinball, with a fun fair theme for coutries that didn't follow baseball.
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thunder
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Re: Komon Steve horse race help

Post by thunder »

Thanks, great help. Found the game instruction panel, unfortunately rust deteriorated. It reads, Place penny in coin slot and push in. Pull lever out fully. Depress lever on left or right side to release game ball. - best i can make out. The balls release at the front bottom on left and right held in with a sprung trap door using the long bar. By lifting the long bars on either side, you can control the ball speed. I can find no other machine that operates in this way.
I've decided to make a ply table top case for the machine and I'll upload pictures as I progress.
Any other info welcome.
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by pennymachines »

Hi Thunder,

There were a few early racecourse pintables, including the all-mechanical Speedway (D. Gottlieb & Co., Chicago, 1933) with five Bluebird-like cars racing towards the player,
Kings of Turf (H C Evans & Co., Chicago, 1935), with horses electro-mechanically propelled around a circular track, ERBÜ-Rennen (Erich Büttner, Leipzig, 1935), Tura Derby (Tura Automaten, Leipzig, 1935) and IMO-Rennen (Jentzsch & Meerz, Leipzig, 1936), all three of which used clockwork to advance horses towards the player.

Your game was patented by Basil Scuby and George Kettlewell in 1933. It's the first British game of this sort I've seen and the method of using the ball bearings directly to move the horses is novel.
thunder wrote:I've decided to make a ply table top case for the machine and I'll upload pictures as I progress
Before cutting ply, what is the front door made of (visible in your last picture, above)? It doesn't look like ply. I think you should try to match this for the cabinet, preferably sourcing some suitably old timber. Judging by the Cycle Racer cabinet you made, you have the skill to make a great job of it and I think this machine deserves the extra effort.

So here's what you need to study:- 21 pages of detailed description, including 11 pages of technical drawings: Patent GB416494

I really look forward to seeing how it turns out, and don't hesitate to ask our experts if you need more advice. :tarah:
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thunder
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by thunder »

Unfortunately, it is a ply front panel, but now you have sent the design which is a plain case, all ply, I think, I will make something that will complement it. Only real problem I can see is how to keep the balls in the case. I thought they ran in the tracks, not on top, as the drawings show.
I guess the slot on the left and right front of the case that holds the launch bars will need to be really tight to stop the ball falling out. I guess that's why the design changed to the flicker type, but this means I've got the mark1 version - result!

The metalwork is in the de-rust soak and I'm thinking of an ebonised guilded case. Pictures of progress to follow.
!THUMBS!

Horses needed !PUZZLED!
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by slotalot »

thunder wrote:Horses needed !PUZZLED!
TESCO meat counter !PUZZLED!
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by pennymachines »

slotalot wrote:TESCO meat counter !PUZZLED!
:lol:

You mentioned that one horse remained. If you're lucky, it might turn out to be a toy that was available in the '30s and can still be obtained. More likely, you'll need to recast from it. Any idea what metal? Close-up?

I would avoid modern ply, if possible, even if you plan to ebonise and guild it. It doesn't resemble the old stuff. Maybe Gameswat can offer advice on sourcing old ply...
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by thunder »

It will be something solid !!THUMBSX2!! and I found a side panel with an image on it, completely shot and full of worm. Just hope I can jam it in my scanner, or I'll have to resort to image transfer and bucket of water... The horse has got 1 leg and a headless rider, same as blueprint, lead, I think alloy, balls wooden metal !PUZZLED!
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by pennymachines »

thunder wrote:I think alloy, balls wooden metal !PUZZLED!
Was that a statement or a question? :!?!:
The balls will be of weighty steel, of course.
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by thunder »

Would you stick with the plain case as blueprint, polished brown or be more imaginative ?
Do you think the legs fold? Can't figure that and the coin box hanging underneath.

I suppose it's best to follow the plan and make it as original as possible.
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by pennymachines »

So the cabinet would appear to derive its rigidity from a ply clad metal chassis. The ply would almost certainly have been painted. Again, the piece you have may provide clues as to colour. It's quite likely to have had some decoration, which won't be depicted in the patent. Even if it didn't, showmen were in the habit of decorating machines if they thought some enhancement was warranted, so yes, why not be imaginative?

I think the stand was detachable and I'm guessing it would have been metal - possibly angle iron. I have something similar on a Rockola Wings pintable, which also has a metal cashbox protruding from below the cabinet. The cashbox would have allowed more coins to accumulate before the machine needed emptying, and was probably intended to be independently lockable. I would be inclined not to bother with the stand or cashbox. It could always be added afterwards, if desired.
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by thunder »

I've cleaned and de-rusted the metal work, repainted the frame, greased all the moving bits and replaced the wooden ball catching base.

I've made a case of solid mahogany with some original brass angle, some new copied transfer images and perspex for the glass.

What I'm missing is the playing field level bubble (clear tube with black lines), also ball wires? over the top row of the holes (fine shaped wire to guide ball). If you have a picture of what they look like, it would be a great help.

I've taken loads of pictures that I will post !!THUMBSX2!!

Side panel transfer before and after:
Side panel original remains
Side panel original remains


After scanning, photo editing, etc.
After scanning, photo editing, etc.

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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by pennymachines »

Nice job with the transfer - it's an attractive feature.
Why did you use perspex rather than glass? !PUZZLED!
I doubt anyone will post a picture of the machine. I've not seen another example, but who knows? :!?!:
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by thunder »

I'm looking for a picture of the wires that are over the ball holes, top row. Very fine wire, bent to a point, off any machine that has them.
I have loads of perspex and toughened glass would be expensive.

Whoever buys it can change it if they want. A couple of screws and slide it out.

Any idea as to the level bubble?
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by thunder »


komonsteve rebuild a quick video of progress
still a bit to do :byee:
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by pennymachines »

Looking good thunder! !!THUMBSX2!!
Can't wait to see the next episode.
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Re: Komonsteve horse race help

Post by urbanbody »

!!THUMBSX2!!
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