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Tokens/coins found in Roman Head bandit

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 3:34 pm
by tammy
I found these 3 old penny size tokens/coins in the front window of a 1930s goose necked one are bandit in 1973. I still have them but have never seen anything similar. They are old penny size with a quality milled edge and look. I at first thought they were gold but then realised probably gilt coated. They were wrapped in a little newspaper and even today have a mint look... Photos haven't come out good! Writing on portrait side reads "HRN The Prince of Wales, KG" and the reverse is like a Jewish star and words "GUILD MEMBER T.C."

Does anyone know anything about them please? Thank you, John.

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:39 pm
by treefrog
Some kind of token for a group or guild, but the Hexagram was not just used by the Jewish community, but also used by Masons, the Guild of Brewers and for Satanic purposes. So make your guesses. Knowing some of the previous Prince of Wales had associations with the Masons, I would place my bet there.

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Mon Jul 11, 2016 10:40 pm
by tammy
Thank you for 1st reply. On the early Mills Roman Head bandit (which was from the Reighton Gap arcade originally) on the reel strips were picture of gold award coins- could these coin tokens been the original from the 30s period, but why over all my years in slot collecting have I never ever seen one before or after. I have over the later years aquired plenty of all the usual old penny tokens but still feel these are possibly rare and need explaining what they are esp' whilst the older generations are still here to do it. Even amongst the coin collecting world nothing similar seems to exist. The quality on these tokens is very high (the photo is poor). Has anyone else any ideas especially those who were in the old penny machine trade in those days???

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 2:04 pm
by pennymachines
They're difficult to make out in your picture - I think you need to set the camera to macro or move further away to get focus. However, I'm pretty sure they're not coin-op related, despite being found in a one arm bandit. Here's the Mills Roman Head Gold Award reel symbol and a token from said machine, featuring a stylized owl (Mills logo).

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 2:12 pm
by gameswat
And can't say I've ever seen a high quality coin-op token of any kind, always rudimentary at best.

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2016 1:22 am
by bob
Oh Gameswat how can you of all people, an Aussie say that. The prize token in my collection is one put out in 1927 by Mick (sadly I can't remember his surname) the owner of a milk bar/amusement parlour in the town of Katoomba in the blue mountains just outside of Sydney Australia. This has "MICK I AMICUS HUMANIS GENESIS 1927" (latin for "Mick a friend of the human race" inscribed on one side and "BANK OF LA PLAZA KATOOMBA" encircling "LOANED FOR AMUSEMENT ONLY" on the reverse side.
What's more, you too can be the owner of one of these most elegant penny sized tokens, as there is one on sale on Australian ebay at the moment: http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/330982213165 ... K:MEWAX:IT for sale for $A30.
eBay item number: 330982213165

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2016 6:01 am
by bob
Just noticed that there are two more of these tokens on Australian ebay:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/AUSTRALIA-19 ... 0982213165
and:
http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/1927-BANK-of ... 1677837062

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:34 am
by gameswat
Ah yes Bob, totally forgot about that one, as I didn't find it myself but you gave it to me! And thanks for the eBay links as I just purchased the cheapest. I used to look for these every now and again and in all the years only saw one previous to these for sale on eBay, and wasn't cheap.

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 12:50 pm
by badpenny
pennymachines wrote:Here's the Mills Roman Head Gold Award reel symbol and a token from said machine, featuring a stylized owl (Mills logo).

Really? ..... Strewth, and there was me all these years thinking it was amphorae with mystic symbols like pyramid and Pharoah type symbols, but what that's got to do with Romans, lord only knows.
Owl will do I suppose, although I still can't see it.

BP

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 1:11 pm
by gameswat
badpenny wrote:pennymachines wrote:
Here's the Mills Roman Head Gold Award reel symbol and a token from said machine, featuring a stylized owl (Mills logo).

I totally missed that quote PM, worst owl I've ever seen!


Really? ..... Strewth, and there was me all these years thinking it was amphorae with mystic symbols like pyramid and Pharoah type symbols, but what that's got to do with Romans, lord only knows.
Owl will do I suppose, although I still can't see it.
Really? ..... Strewth, and there was me all these years thinking it was a laying maiden with her knee up, taking a hard earned rest after holding and pouring that damn amphorae on the front of the machine since the early 1930s!?!

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:03 pm
by john t peterson
Now that you blokes have pulled out of the EU, would you please go back to speaking plain English? Please?? :HaHa:

J Peterson
Low strewth in America

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window?? What are they? can you help??

Posted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 12:55 pm
by pennymachines
badpenny wrote:Owl will do I suppose, although I still can't see it.
It is an amphora isn't it? I can see that now. :o
Amphorae, pyramids, Pharaohic symbols, owls - all this iconography makes me wonder if the Mortimer Birdsul Mills clan were Freemasons.

Don't worry John - plain English will be resumed as soon as possible.

Don't tell me this isn't Samson destroying the pagan Temple of Dagon...

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 6:26 pm
by tammy
I have took some more new pictures of the tokens/coins that I found in the 1930s goose neck bandit case window in the 1970s. I still have the gilt gold platted tokens. Also I have got in touch with Freddie Bailey. If anyone might know what they are, it could be him with his many years in the amusement machine trade over here.
tammy

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Fri Mar 08, 2019 11:10 pm
by coppinpr
I think these might be gaming tokens used in private clubs, usually for card playing (it was not considered "correct" to have cash on the card table). If they are, they are very late examples. It was common practice to put a royal head on the token, often the Prince of Wales. Tokens with Edward the VIII's grandfather Edward VII as prince of Wales are quite common, as are William IV and Victoria. I have never seen a George V. so possibly a Masonic club gambling token.

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 10:00 am
by brigham
If they haven't tarnished, then they are likely to be made of gold. That's David, who abdicated, I think, which is right for the age of the machine. It was probably in one of the more 'racy' Gentlemen's clubs.

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 10:21 am
by tammy
Thank you coppinpr, you really got me thinking a lot with your interesting reply. You could be right but I still am bordering on token or coin for an event... The trouble is, someone has gone to long lengths to produce the detailed quality of the effigy of the prince, also the milled edges like they have on the old sixpences and halfcrowns. Why gilt these tokens too? Gilting is using a very thin layer of gold so I believe!
The reverse star is interesting and so are the words in capitals GUILD MEMBER T.C. What could the T.C. be?

The coin tokens, as I previously said, were in the front window segment which was probably designed for 3 tokens penny size. They were wrapped in yellowed mag paper that had part of an article about peep machines. You wouldn't have known they were there till I unscrewed the back bit. I have always felt they were something special, probably an original gold award, maybe only done for a while. Someone out there must know???

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:03 am
by tammy
I got in touch with Freddie Bailey yesterday and he wanted me to send some pictures... however unless I have got it wrong, site private messages and site email don't allow me to send pictures... so maybe the site administrator could copy and paste them to him.
Could the letters T.C. be Trade Craftsmen? Or is it something to do with one of the many amusement machine suppliers emblems from the hay day of machines? I wonder what worth and value they might have? tammy

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 11:48 am
by gameswat
Tammy, I really think you're barking up the wrong tree about these being anything to do with the amusement industry. As stated by many of the hardcore collectors here earlier in the thread these have nothing marked on them that in any way correlates with other gold award tokens or standard arcade tokens. The gold award tokens I've had either showed the value or had a blank space to engrave or stamp the value. And I've never seen any coin op tokens with the king or queen on them, or gilded for that matter. I'd guess that an earlier collector in the 60's or early 70's placed them in the machine to use in the Gold Award window since they fitted and that's the only reason. I've done the same thing myself too many times, grabbed whatever tokens or coins would fit the job when I didn't have the originals. And I've found lots of oddball tokens and coins being used in machines because they were something that fitted. Like these American presidents tokens that I found in a British machine in the US as they happen to be the same diameter as a Penny. They were in the machine but have no relationship to the coin-op world.

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 2:52 pm
by treefrog
I suspect unless it be solid gold will be worth very little.

I love it when I find tokens used in slot machines as over the years apart from odd items wedged in various places you find both manufacturers and operators often used tokens instead of washers and in other mechanical roles. Latest one when restoring a Shefras Payola I found the below disc used as a washer....it states “the official disc of the shove ha’penny control association” there is even a reg design number. Normally they leave tokens associated with operation, but this is is a little different... I always put them back whereI found them, better that way :cool:



Loved the Payola by the way and I seem to have a problem wanting to keep all machines I get sorted....

Re: Rare tokens/coins found in 1930s Roman Head bandit case window. What are they?

Posted: Sat Mar 09, 2019 3:28 pm
by brigham
Nothing to do with Alan Freed, then?