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brigham
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Re: How many cherries?

Postby brigham » Mon Mar 09, 2020 5:59 pm

"...But that does definitely establish that Mills did originate single-cherry pay, and it existed before the post-war era..."
I'm satisfied that it dates from 1939, a conclusion that I have drawn from contemporary advertising.

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treefrog
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Re: How many cherries?

Postby treefrog » Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:32 pm

Jennings had single cherry in late thirties......

Any BP back to why you raised this in the first place, there are so many other things to identify fake war eagles and the one cherry or two cherry is not a guaranteed method. It is not that tough to change to a two cherry if so committed

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Re: How many cherries?

Postby badpenny » Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:21 pm

Come on then TF share with us please.

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treefrog
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Re: How many cherries?

Postby treefrog » Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:45 am

Share what how to convert or what Jennings......I think you know the first being a technical the wizard of our era in the art the slot machine :cool: , but I have seen the Jennings Super Chief offered as an option single cherry payout from 1939.......this became available on other chiefs after this.

One of the last repro war eagles we discussed on the forum had two cherry payout......
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=7352&p=53995&hilit=War+eagle#p53995

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Re: How many cherries?

Postby quadibloc » Tue Mar 10, 2020 1:00 pm

badpenny wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:06 pm
I think we now have enough evidence to ascertain that single cherry pay out on Mills machines didn't appear pre WWII.
Huh? I thought this thread contained proof that, contrary to what I had thought, single cherry payout did originate in 1939, shortly before World War II started.
badpenny wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:06 pm
Also it rules out War Eagles and Castle Fronts.
Now this is true. The Chrome Bell was among Mills' last pre-war machines, and the War Eagle was among the first Silent Bells from 1931, so single cherry payout wasn't around back that far.
badpenny wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 2:06 pm
I can't imagine a profit driven operator spending time and money altering a machine so it would pay out additional combinations.
Ouch!

I certainly agree that a profit-driven operator would never alter a machine to pay out additional combinations... without also altering the reel strips and payout discs to ensure it remained profitable afterwards.

But from my reading of advertisements for reconditioned second-hand slots, altering machines to have currently fashionable payouts - no lemons on the first reel, single-cherry payout, triple-cherry payout and no lemons anywhere, mystery pay, criss-cross or tic-tac-toe style - was not only possible, but even common.

The War Eagle in Dieter Ladwig's book Slot Machines (on page 48) has a payout card which resembles the original payout cards for that machine in style, but which indicates a single-cherry payout. A fanciful but misguided collector, or a post-war alteration during the machine's service life? I'd be hesitant to say.

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brigham
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Re: How many cherries?

Postby brigham » Tue Mar 10, 2020 4:04 pm

I'd be hesitant to say...
...or buy.

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Re: How many cherries?

Postby quadibloc » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:20 pm

treefrog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:32 pm
Jennings had single cherry in late thirties......
Although Jennings appears to be the first to switch from lemons on the third reel to cherries on the third reel, in making an extensive search of Billboard and Automatic Age to learn about the evolution of slot machine payouts, I've seen no evidence whatever of single-cherry pay by Jennings (or Pace or Watling, for that matter) until the cessation of hostilities for World War II.
So if you are right, there is something I can learn from you. What Jennings machine had it?

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treefrog
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Re: How many cherries?

Postby treefrog » Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:32 pm

quadibloc wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 6:20 pm
treefrog wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 7:32 pm
Jennings had single cherry in late thirties......
Although Jennings appears to be the first to switch from lemons on the third reel to cherries on the third reel, in making an extensive search of Billboard and Automatic Age to learn about the evolution of slot machine payouts, I've seen no evidence whatever of single-cherry pay by Jennings (or Pace or Watling, for that matter) until the cessation of hostilities for World War II.
So if you are right, there is something I can learn from you. What Jennings machine had it?
Machine mentioned above was offered from around August 1939, so pre war.....

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Re: How many cherries?

Postby quadibloc » Tue Mar 10, 2020 11:48 pm

It is true that the Jennings Super Chief dates from 1939. I could only find three surviving examples pictured on the Internet, all had double-cherry payout.
It is true that single-cherry pay was offered on Jennings post-war machines. The first three of them were the Bronze Chief, the Super Deluxe Club Chief, and the Standard Chief. Are you sure you aren't confusing the Super Chief with the Super Deluxe Club Chief?
So far, I have been unable to even find an advertisement for the Jennings Super Chief.

Looking a little harder, I have found it advertised in Billboard. And I'd seen the advertisements before. Mostly, they talked about the machine's new, improved slug rejector. (It didn't have a visible escalator; this was added in a later model, so the slug rejector must not have been perfect.)

But on page 87 of the June 3, 1939 Billboard, there was a big ad for the Jennings Super Chief. And that proves you're right. The last paragraph of the ad copy is: "May be equipped with special 1 cherry on first reel payout combination or any other popular combination desired."

This wording and placement suggests to me that Mills was still first - but Jennings, at least, started imitating the popular one-cherry payout before the War, even if Watling and Pace apparently didn't.

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treefrog
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Re: How many cherries?

Postby treefrog » Wed Mar 11, 2020 12:34 am

Posting the below as referenced in Peter Bach’s book called Collectors Treasury of Antique Slot Machines from Contemporary Advertising. A wonderful reference book with almost 500 pages of machines in chronological order, produced 40 years ago. One of the few books I often reference and recommended if you don’t already have.

This machine is covered by about 4 adverts over 1939, starting in July. Not a common machine I guess.
841768F4-FCC1-44AD-A497-D0DA4409F5D4.jpeg


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