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slotalot
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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby slotalot » Thu Jun 18, 2020 5:35 pm

pennymachines wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 10:37 pm
I'm not sure when these were made, but they look very '30s,
as I was awake anyway...... lol.
I thought I would add this, the badge on the machine i had states 146 Pentonville Road as Hoopers address, and according to Paul Braithwaite they relocated there in 1934, so that should give us the earliest date for manufacture !THUMBS!
!BedZIrQBWk~$(KGrHqEOKicEry!vFYmMBK9ZCevWJQ~~_12.jpg

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gameswat
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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby gameswat » Thu Jun 18, 2020 6:59 pm

PM, I'd suggest you're very likely right about a wartime built machine. I think they recycled those Bally style spring bumpers in a simpler way to save on the trouble of screening playfields, and the scoring unit appears to be a ripoff from the Daval American Beauty of June 1934. I have a spare unit here after having restored the machine for a friend. Since it uses Bally bumpers then it can't be earlier than Dec 1936.
american beauty.jpg

geofflove
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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby geofflove » Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:14 pm

Well mine arrived today. A bit of a state as expected, but seems to be all there apart from the cash box cover so a good start. Appears to have all 5 balls too!

Will need a total strip as all the metal bits mechs are rusted but not beyond recovery I don’t think. Will also need a total rewire I suspect as the insulation is falling off in places.

First challenge will be to get into it. The two large screws on the top edge nearest the player appear to be the key to opening it are totally rusted in. I’ll have a go with a screw extractor but failing that I might have to drill the heads off and then replace the top strip of wood.
Lots of fun to come....

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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby slotalot » Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:18 pm

geofflove wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:14 pm
The two large screws on the top edge nearest the player appear to be the key to opening it are totally rusted in.
Try heating the screws with a hot soldering iron, that might free them up. |/XX\|

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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby gameswat » Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:26 pm

geofflove wrote:
Thu Jun 18, 2020 7:14 pm
The two large screws on the top edge nearest the player appear to be the key to opening it are totally rusted in.
Are they actually screws geoff? On any other pinball those are coach bolts that have nuts to be undone once the door is off inside the upper door edge. Screws wouldn't make sense as anybody could get into the machine. But having said that Hoopers seemed to have done things their own way, so who knows!?! :o

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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby geofflove » Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:57 am

No they are not screws! Thanks - my cursory look ignored this fact! They are now out, revealing two things....

Firstly, the thing has been eaten by worms at some time. They only seem to have been interested in the ply playfield. It’s mostly OK, but feels slightly soft in a couple of places. Just battling with my conscience as to whether to replace the ply - lots of work drilling, refitting and wiring all those bits - or to leave be. I'm erring in leaving be, although I do wonder if I should do a woodworm treatment just in case they are still at it in there? I don’t really need to buy 5 litres of the stuff though! Any thoughts?

The second thing is that mine might be a mark 2 compared to Stuart’s, and it might solve the reason for the difference of opinion about how they work....

The metal playfield in mine is connected to 0v. However the ball is not used as a connection, the playfield merely serves to connect all the bumper springs. There are then brass tabs with a hole beneath each spring which the spring hits, completing the circuit, as someone else described. See pics. I assume mine came later, maybe due to the probs Stuart described with having to keep it so clean.

I’m wondering on mine if the capacitor ‘thing’ also serves to dampen spring bounce causing multiple scoring when hit, as I can imagine a bit of a ‘boing’ effect?!

It looks like the green of mine is original compared to Stuart’s brown. Maybe denoting mk 2! A bit like having a vinyl roof.
B1981DE5-0094-4205-83B3-519EA8F721EFa.jpg
C87A2795-5FBA-40D2-A5BF-8C6E1537AC7Ba.jpg

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brigham
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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby brigham » Fri Jun 19, 2020 7:24 am

The hole through which the end of the bumper spring protrudes is frighteningly small.
It will certainly register at the slightest touch; but setting the springs, especially after years of use, looks like being a major job.

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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby badpenny » Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:01 am

The thick plottens! !PUZZLED!

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slotalot
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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby slotalot » Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:59 am

geofflove wrote:
Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:57 am

The second thing is that mine might be a mark 2 compared to Stuart’s and it might solve the reason for the difference of opinion about how they work....
Very Interesting, but not entirely unexpected.
We have to remember that these machines were made long before any sort of standard or kite mark was applied. Tthey would to some extent be "making it up as they go along".

My opinion is that your machine would have come first, as they would have been trying to copy the American design, but with the absence of the carbon ring forming the contact with the metal pin, and the small hole size, leads me to think that there was more chance of the metal to metal contact welding shut due to the spark. If this was to happen, it could lead to damage of the score up coil, or even a fire. :oops:

My second reason for thinking yours came first is, why would they alter the design and make the machine more costly to build? !PUZZLED! By doing away with the pin and ring, and replacing it with the ball making direct contact, you do away with a lot of extra parts. There is no adjustments to make and keep up with, and it would be quicker and cheaper to produce.

These machine were never meant to be of high quality, but back in the day they would have been quite a novelty as most pinballs of this date didn't use electricity. :zapa:

I rest my case. !SURRENDER!

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Re: Hoopers Automatics Skill Score pinball machine

Postby geofflove » Fri Jun 19, 2020 4:04 pm

Interesting! Yes you could be right in terms of order of production. The hole is very small - that was my first thought too! Actually alignment doesn’t look as bad as i first feared. You can rotate the springs quite easily for one axis of movement and the ‘holes’ can be moved through the other axis. Of course how long they will stay aligned in use is quite another matter.

I guess the big capacitor was partly to stop the arcing although how much we will see. I’m also doubtful about how much capacitance will be left in mine. I don’t really want to remove it but guess I might need to maybe add another in if this is a problem once up and running.


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