Only saying ..........

[badpenny]

I've been doing a bit of tidying up of my private messages and posts on this forum.

I've come to realise how often we get asked to solve a problem, it's not always new comers, but generally is.
Often many posts appear asking questions, solutions offered .... everybody happy and grateful.

However there is an irritatingly high number of those pleading for assistance who are given numerous clues of what to do, who then basically *&#! off .... no please, thank you or kiss my &+~*

I don't need my ego stroking, I just feel it's basic good manners.
Probably more than anything I want to know if we were correct or indeed have something new to learn. Too often It seems though it's too much effort to write back and say: -
A) Yup, that did it, thanks guys
Or even .......
B) Strewth you lot are hopeless, thanks for the effort but I've lost interest now.

Sadly we also have a couple of long time members who only ask questions and then shuffle back into the shadows.

I think my favourite one this year was the one that ignored every question put to them and just came back with more questions. Even though they were directed to HERE. Where the answer was detailed. Three times that happened. They then finally replied with "Yay for me I fixed it!" ...... and then descibed basically what was contained in the link.
I'm also amazed that it's always the same half a dozen members that respond, offering help. There are many out there who know so much more and don't contribute at all. I asked a fellow slotty a while back why they hadn't helped out on a particular problem, when I knew he had rebuilt the same kind of machine and knew them back to front. His reason was ... "It's taken me years to learn that, why should I give away my knowledge for nowt?"

My response to that is, if you don't give back to the hobby you contribute to strangling it.
I'd hazard a guess there are less people joining than leaving, and if you look around you at the average age of collectors there's likely to be even more going.
Well that's my moan over, I shall still respond to enquiries and do my best to help as I hope will the usual suspects.

BP ..... now fifty twelve years old and clearly displaying grumpy tendancies.

[coppinpr]

Thanks BP for ALL you do for the good of this forum, it IS appreciated, and thats a fact!!

[badpenny]

Thanks for that coppinpr ..... I was including you in the merry band of contributors that always responds to calls for help.
I was just moaning ........

[clubconsoles]

I think its the case on a lot of forums that people join, ask for help with the one post, and never come back to post again.
It also seemed like that on the classic car forum i used to post on!
I am amazed at how lazy some are when,despite repeated requests for pictures, they fail to post any.
In my opinion, if ten newbies post, and only one goes on to really take the plunge with additional machine purchases, then the time helping out the other nine will have been worthwhile.
Don't forget there are many out there who just want the one machine for their game room and have no real interest in collecting further machines, so why should we expect them to come back and make further posts?
I am in my early 50s and i know a few younger collectors are entering the hobby now, which can only be a good thing.
I can see a time, in the not too distant future, when ALL coin operated machines will be a thing of the past with near field payments via debit cards. This will hopefully help the hobby as I think the nostalgia for these devices can only increase with many of the older machines being seen as works of art in their own right as well as functioning antiques.

[widget2k4]

Well said old chap
I'm not a long time member on here but I do try and help out whenever I can, I also noticed its only half a dozen or so members that chirp up with help all the time,
I also stopped posting stuff in the resources as after all the hours I spend recreating or fixing them I don't recall yet anyone saying thanks for the effort or anything, the resources I think should be made a paying area to visit?
Or maybe I'm just being grumpy and moaning like you BP, maybe it's catching lol

[john t peterson]

Here's my 2 cents.

The internet has encouraged a general sense of entitlement. It's all free!!! (other than the connection fee and you can get that FREE too from your local Starbucks or library or unsuspecting neighbor.) As newspapers have learned to their dismay, once you offer something for nothing, people resent the idea of even having to pay a pittance for something they once got for free.

This generalized feeling that I can get what I want for free off the internet encourages the notion that there is no cost involved with the production of the information requested. It's a short jump from the concept of "no cost" to "no thanks" for information provided. That, coupled with a more general sense of entitlement, produces the effect BP laments.

We all know differently. It's taken most of us years to acquire the knowledge that we now share with the newbies, for free. As noted above, this encourages the next generation of collectors as well as those who just want to understand and enjoy the pleasures of times that will not be repeated.

There is a grander purpose. Knowledge expands the human experience like helium to a balloon. It's like bread cast upon the waters. We cannot know the full effect of our sharing our collective knowledge of this wonderful hobby. Despite the greedy know-nothings who steal our wisdom with not so much as a "thank you," WE are better people for sharing.

J Peterson
Free-loader from America

[moonriver]

Speaking of helium, we greedily exploit that too as until recently it has only been found naturally underground in a few places on earth and it cannot be made by man, and we use it for frivolous things like filling party balloons or silly voices.

[treefrog]

Never bothered me - people who come and go, that is life, for some it's a few queries like, "what's my machine worth", to helping source parts of fix issues, but I always wonder what happens to those who have a lot of interest for a period of a year or two and then disappear.

The ones I think are a shame to lose are the people who find the site and once worked in the industry or have family from a famous maker, as it would great to sap more knowledge from these people, but they fritter away..

You're right about helium, the stupidity of man, it is a finite supply, essential for some engineering and medical uses, and idiots piss it into balloons or their heads and it does not get retained in the atmosphere and goes out into space, lost for ever.

By the way, you need to pay your subs to see the resources I believe.

[widget2k4]

I believe the Resources are free and no subs required?

[badpenny]

Resources are part of the Forum, it's only The Arena and helium you have to pay for.

Good comments everyone. JP as usual "Trumps" us all with his sage like comments

[bryans fan]

JP as usual "Trumps" us all with his sage like comments

I seen what you did then! Very drole BP

[pennymachines]

Sadly we also have a couple of long time members who only ask questions and then shuffle back into the shadows.

Is he talking about me?

[coppinpr]

What made you think he meant you MR P. was it the "shuffling" bit?

[pennymachines]

Or is because I only ask questions?

[arrgee]

Interesting thread, and with the current contributors above, only serve to reinforce BP's original comments about just a few contributing to the many.

And it is not just this Forum, I am sure that one of Jerry's reasons for not being able to continue with MMM was that it was very difficult to keep writing articles for the mag, and again, only a few contributed. I was brought up in an post-war period where please and thank you were normal parts of your vocabulary (or if not, a verbal or sometimes actual slap round the head was encountered) that has been eroded by a must-have-now society with little gratitude for others.

Ok moan over, back to the Bumper rebuild - anyone got any original plans I can have

[treefrog]

One thing that is evident is how many posts get no responses at all, I sometimes feel like answering just for the sake of it, eg...

..Jimmycowman recently asked about the right lock for a tinny Mutoscope, no response where I am sure at least 20% of people own one. I have a restoration project and was going to check if it had a lock.......

Widget recently asked about the long spring for a grip testers. I am certain there was another question on the same about a year or so back, but could not find on the site so did not respond as I don't have one. But many on here will own one......

Polaris asked a question about large cased Parkers machine (looked nice by the way and never seen one), no response

BP had a challenge on a eBay newspaper article, have to admit I did not understand this one so did not respond, sorry BP

Coppin put a question around the decimal award cards on Jennings, mmmm I could have responded here as not uncommon and often seen on decimal conversion machines using value rather than numbers of coins, which is where all machines went anyway to this day

A newbie lol_penny put in a request on how to get a rol a top, no responses, so has gone now probably....

This is just the last few months......must try harder

[widget2k4]

Very well said treefrog

[polaris]

I for one am truly thankful for all the info that i am able for find on this site. most of the points have been brought up already but it is noticeable that there are only a few regular people who do contribute massively to most of the calls for help. it likely is true B.P that there are lot of collectors given that these machines are also around fifty twelve years old that may no longer have the same enthusiasm for the hobby. I don't remember these machines from my childhood and there has to be many like me on the site who greatly appreciate all the help ,resources , stories at our disposal. i think too that many people who come on have so much info and a vast amount of topics at hand that they don't feel the need to get involved. i genuinely think also that there are a lot of members who would like to contribute but maybe don't have the confidence to post on topics and perhaps even lurk in the shadows just for the banter

[coppinpr]

The problem is (and I know ive said this before) a forum lives or dies by its posts. A steady stream of posts (even if frivolous or wildly off subject like many of mine ) keeps a forum ticking over,if there are no new posts people stop looking ,fade away from the forum and miss just the answer they were waiting for.

I dont do my yearly check on "the state of the forum" till November but it seems to me there has been a marked drop in posts since about Feb. I too have noticed at least two new members with questions basically ignored after a quick welcome from BP . The reason this happens I guess is the small number of people who always try to help simply dont know that type of machine so cant answer,but someone on here knows so come on guys ,if your the expert needed then step up to the plate

[pennymachines]

I'm generally amazed at the high number of questions that do get comprehensively answered but it's true, I'm sure we could do better if more of the 'lurkers' came forward instead of assuming the usual suspects know all the answers. I for one, have never owned a tinny Mutoscope and can't supply Samson Grip spring dimensions, because I no longer have one.