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geofflove
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby geofflove » Sun May 10, 2020 3:30 pm

There is mention on the front of ‘mystery payouts’! It’s on a separate plastic part displayed on the front, so I suspect your thoughts are correct and someone has added this on at some time.

By way of today’s progress for those who might find it helpful....

I discovered that the main bank of cam switches had been knocked backwards one one side, meaning switch 1 wasn’t operating. There are a couple of adjustment screws for this, so that was out right, and the contacts for switch 1 also needed bending slightly. This got the microswitch on the coin op working and the machine now makes one cycle before switching off again. The coin mech will need a complete strip down I think, so I still need to check the rest of it.

The brake on the middle reel was still not releasing. I checked the voltage on the solenoid which did indeed appear at a point in the cycle. I then discover an open circuit on the solenoid coil. This filled me with dread, as I thought a rewind would be the only option. I first had to remove the metal chassis that the 3 solenoids are mounted on. I then drilled the rivets on the solenoid and removed the solenoid from the unit. I managed to remove the switches and actuator from the coil. I carefully removed the paper covering from the coil and was about to start unwinding the coil from the core when I spotted a tiny break in the coil just before it entered the end terminator. A quick touch with the soldering iron and it was back to 800 ohms on the coil like the other two. Re assembled and replaced, confident that this will get the middle wheel turning.

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Plugged in to check my work and a quick spark and blew 2 fuses! Then realised that in removing and replacing the bank of solenoids I must have knocked the switch mounted on the cam on the front of the motor, shorting some of the tabs where the wires are soldered on to them! I soon bent these back but now have to wait for some replacement fuses.

While I’m waiting for those to arrive I might attempt the coin mech..... I’ve also removed the ‘extra’ payout unit for the time being.

Hope this is helpful to someone sometime. Will be back with the next update!

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badpenny
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby badpenny » Sun May 10, 2020 9:09 pm

It's all good stuff "geofflove".
You're making progress and leaving a good trail for those who follow the next time someone needs advice.

Most of these machines end up in the too confuddling to be tackled pile. When actually they're not, they're very basic in their operation. Which actually may be part of the problem in so much as the game itself is quite basic, so the effort may not seem rewarding to some. I've currently got two identical ones (with the winking lion on the front) awaiting my attention, but so long as I've still got the majority of my To do List to tackle my attention isn't likely to wander very far in their direction.
Keep up the good work, it's astonishing to think it's nearly eight years since we lost the late/great Harold English. His regular contributions to this forum kept these electro mechanical beasties in view.

BP :cool:

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pennymachines
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby pennymachines » Mon May 11, 2020 3:42 pm

Delving deeper into the forum, I rediscovered this (currently 8 page) topic on Rotamints which you may find helpful. It includes troubleshooting a Duett and English diagrams and a video showing the game operating.

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geofflove
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby geofflove » Mon May 11, 2020 5:42 pm

Thanks for the replies and info. While awaiting fuse delivery I sorted the coin mech today. It needed a good clean to get it working smoothly. I’m unsure what coin it’s meant to use. The details say a sixpence but this just drops through the reject slot. I’m wondering if it’s actually changed to a three penny bit? Anyway I temporarily bodged by blocking the reject channel below and removed the magnet so it now take a new 1p! I’ve ordered to threepenny bits so when they arrive I’ll see if I can undo my bodging!

I’ve also cleaned and oiled the payout mech which seems good now.

Interesting to see another machine and diagram like mine. Both show the payout motor and the pic you added shows the motor on the back. As you’ll see in pics mine doesn’t and although there are some holes in the chassis there’s nothing to suggest one has recently been removed so am puzzled. I can’t honestly see how the payout mechanism will work. Looking at the payout cam there just seems to be 2 bumps running across the full width if the payout switches. I can’t see how this will work to pay the different combinations of wins And given a motor is shown on the diagram in my machine I’m hoping I’m not going to reach in the end a find a key part is actually missing! Here is a shot of the cams.
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Also looking at the pic I’ve just noticed what look like some removed ‘bumps’ to the left. Hmmmmm! Any one got a technique to replace ‘bumps’ on these cams?!

geofflove
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby geofflove » Mon May 11, 2020 7:28 pm

A further question! Can anyone explain the workings of the three wheels in terms of the diagram? (Bottom part of diagram above)

The wipers which connect to the two ball bearings on each disc are obviously the two arrows at the top.

I’m guessing they connect the pairs of poles below them in turn working down the pairs? Is this correct? Or do they connect pairs of the same numbers? And if not what do the numbers refer to? Payout amounts? I thought about it a few times and can’t reach a confident conclusion which i need if I’m to do any trouble shooting!

Thanks

geofflove
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby geofflove » Wed May 13, 2020 7:41 pm

So today I decided to venture into the 3 wheels while I still await fuses. The wheels each contain a pair of sprung pegs with cup shapes on top on which sit 2 tiny ball bearings. When the wheels are replaced the ball bearings are sandwiched between the wheel and the chassis. They then bridge the gap between pairs of stationary contacts thus completing various win circuits. That’s the theory. There were no connections at all. This Was partly down to corroded contacts on the chassis but mainly down to the cups the bearings sit in being carbonised and and spirits behind also not connecting. Dismantled, very fiddly cleaning with brasso and contact cleaner and about 6 reassemblies before I managed to get the 2 ball bearings making reliable contact with each other via the posts and springs. Sadly lost 2 springs in the process and I was caught unawares when I open the first wheel and they pinged! They are in the garage somewhere but an hour of searching did not reveal them. They are tiny! Will now have to find replacements.

I must say I’m not holding out huge hopes of getting the payout system working on this one.....
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geofflove
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby geofflove » Thu May 14, 2020 10:52 am

Does anyone happen to know the purpose of the cam switch in the coin mechanism on this machine?

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The microswitch latches a relay to start one cycle of the machine. Partway through, a lever on the main cam operates, and a lever pushes the coin out of the mechanism where it drops down the chute. As it is ejected, it momentarily breaks the reed switch pictured. The issue is that small coins are ejected without triggering the switch, whereas larger ones trigger the switch. As I don’t know for sure what coin this machine takes, I’m unsure if the coins are meant to trip the switch on ejection or if it’s additional protection against incorrect coins sizes and is not routinely meant to trip? Anyone know or has thoughts? I can’t 100% be sure on the circuit - especially as I’m not 100% sure I even have the right circuit for this model!

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badpenny
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby badpenny » Thu May 14, 2020 11:55 am

geofflove wrote:
Thu May 14, 2020 10:52 am
Does anyone happen to know the purpose of the cam switch in the coin mechanism on this machine?
As I said in my post at the weekend "Switch one starts the game, the coin sits on the switch closing it, the cams at the top turn and close another switch which keeps the game running. There's a lever which moves in and ejects the coin from the gate."
geofflove wrote:
Thu May 14, 2020 10:52 am
The issue is that small coins are ejected without triggering the switch, whereas larger ones trigger the switch. As I don’t know for sure what coin this machine takes, I’m unsure if the coins are meant to trip the switch on ejection or if it’s additional protection against incorrect coins sizes and is not routinely meant to trip? Anyone know or has thoughts? I can’t 100% be sure on the circuit - especially as I’m not 100% sure I even have the right circuit for this model!
Until you identify a coin of the correct weight, diameter and thickness you can't depend on the mechanism following its cycle. I'd be tripping switches manually, however, it happens as I detailed above, the coin can't trip the switch as it's ejected as the ejector lever doesn't move until the switch is tripped.


BP :cool:

geofflove
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby geofflove » Thu May 14, 2020 12:38 pm

Thanks. I can follow the first part of the sequence and that all makes sense. The part I’m struggling with is that once the cam turns to eject the coin, if a coin of a certain size is present it forces another lever to open the reed switch pictured. The microswitch is the one the coin sits on to start the machine.
6E488279-5DE9-42F8-A3E9-FD279EDB9411a.jpg

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badpenny
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Re: Rotamint Duett

Postby badpenny » Thu May 14, 2020 2:12 pm

What other lever?
And if it opens the switch it's interrupting the power. Is that what you're saying?

You need to identify the coin in order to fault find progressively. Otherwise you're just adding to the issues each time. Examine carefully from ...
The coin slot
The gauge behind the slot
The gate where the coin sits on the micro switch, the weight needed to trip the switch, how well it supports different diameter coins so the lever can engage.
The pay out tube

From what I can see of the tube it could be 1d. To be 3d. there would need to be a lot of thickness involved wherever the coin passes vertically, especially the bottom plate of the pay out.
I'd have thought 6d unlikely, I've never seen one on 6d, unless converted by a collector. It was a lot of money to be asking someone to lose.


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