Sega Bell Reels

[vince55]

Hi,
I'm new to this forum and have just brought my first slot machine a Sega Bell, serial number 739491 and stamped July 1965.
It has a Mills mech, no jackpot and no escalator , but all seems to be working ok, but the reel strips are wrong, all 3 strips are the same code GP-CH-1.
Can anyone please tell me what strips it should have and where I might be able to get them, any help would be very welcome.

[treefrog]

Hi and welcome,

As you say it is a Mills mechanism in a Sega cabinet. It looks an earlier mechanism as well, so pre mid 1950’s... not seen the blue rimmed reel tins before. Odd why the strips are same and the right ones more than likely ended with 2 and 3.

I would recommend you go through the process of checking the wins, a little time consuming but worth doing to confirm correct strips needed. There is a thread on here how to do this, will post a link if I can find

[vince55]

Thanks Treefrog,
I'm afraid that I'm a little green on the workings. Have looked on line for new strips but can't find any over in the UK .
The bay shows a confusing selection but no clue to which machine they fit.

[coppinpr]

That reel strip is a Mills Antique Reel Strip CH-537 which is, I think, the only Mills strip where an Orange comes before a BAR. These strips are available BUT there is a problem, CH-537 strips come in 5 types, not 3, so you have to know the list of payouts at the very least. I believe these are sold as a set of five, so easiest way would be to buy the set and test them. Almost certainly, strips 1 (which you have) and strip 2 will be fixed and strip 3 will be either 3, 4 or 5. That is IF the machine has had no changes made to the payout disc.
The big problem is - are you sure that even reel strip 1 is correct for your machine or has someone just slapped on three reel strips he had handy to make the machine look sell-able?

Am I right in thinking the machine works OK but the payouts are wrong? If so, first check if there are any holes in the payout disc filled in. If there are, you may need to find the closest strip set that works and then make small changes where needed.

None of these problems are insurmountable, but it might take a good deal of reel mapping.

[vince55]

Thanks Coppinpr,
I have a feeling you are right in your assumption that they are not the right reels, as all 3 of them are the same number GP- CH-1 and have been sellotaped in place.

[coppinpr]

Then you will need to map the reels. This will be long and tedious. If you need tips on how to do it, ask when you're ready to attempt it.

[vince55]

Well I've mapped the reels and It bears little resemblance to the spools I have, from left to right, looking from the front it is:

BAR.. BAR. .. O
O........ B........ L
L....... C........ P
P........ B....... O
O....... O........ B
P....... C........ P
C...... P... ...... L
L....... C....... O
O........ B...... P
P........ C....... O
O........ B....... BAR + P
BAR... C...........
P........ B....... O
C........ C....... P
P......... O....... O
O......... B....... B
L........ C........ L
B......... P....... O
O......... B...... P
C......... C...... B

Can anyone tell me what set codes these are and where I might be able to buy some?

[coppinpr]

Well, there is good news and bad news.
The first two strips are "Silver Wild Duce 19-1 and 19-2" with just a couple of changes (not uncommon for operators to change the odd symbol to reduce payouts).

On reel 1 the 7th symbol down should be an orange if original.
On reel 2 the 6th symbol down should be a BAR if original.
If you are sure your mapping is correct, these two changes can be made easily to new strips.

That was the good news.
Reel 3 is nothing like any Mills strip I can find.
The nearest is CC-407, but that only has 11 of the 20 correct.

So, first thing is check your mapping of reel 3. If this is definitely correct (I know just how easy it is to map it wrong, one mistake and it falls apart ).
If you're sure of the mapping I would suggest you buy "Silver Duce set 19-1,19-2 & 19-3" then send me 19-3 so I can see the symbol style and I'll make reel three and the reel 1, 2 overlays for you (I will have to charge for the materials at least).

Bernie has the reels strips at: http://www.mrslot1.com

[vince55]

Thank you so much - that is a great help. I will map reel 3 again as it is a little strange that both the plum and the bar seem to be in the same area, so now I can carry on with the restoration.

[coppinpr]

That particular plum should come directly under the BAR as far as I can tell.

[vince55]

Well I have mapped all three reels again, I think I have the order right now, I checked it three times.
I came across a web site called Slot Machine Reel Strips* so below are the results of what I found for sale and how they matched to mine, its hard to make out the code number but I think I have got them right.

Silver Deuce

STRIP 1....................STRIP 2..........................STRIP 3
SHOP
MINE-----------SHOP---------MINE---------SHOP----------MINE

O--------------- * BAR-------------C--------------* B--------------O
BAR----------------P---------------P---------------* O--------------L
P-------------------C---------------C-----------------P--------------P
C-------------------B---------------B----------------B--------------B
P-------------------C---------------C----------------O--------------O
O-------------------B---------------B----------------L--------------L
L-------------------C---------------C--------------* B--------------P
B-------------------B---------------B----------------O--------------O
O-------------------C---------------C---------------B--------------B
C-------------------O---------------O---------------P--------------P
BAR----------------B---------------B----------------L--------------L
O-------------------C---------------C--------------* B--------------O
L--------------------P---------------P-----------------P--------------P
P--------------------B---------------B----------------O--------------O
O--------------------C---------------C-------------BAR----------BAR
P-------------------BAR------------BAR------------L--------------L
C--------------------B---------------B--------------* B--------------P
L--------------------C---------------C----------------O-------------O
O--------------------B---------------B----------------B--------------B
P--------------------O---------------O----------------L--------------L

CC537(CH-1)-------CC537(CH-2A)--------------CC537 3(CH-3A)
NO CHANGE.---------1 CHANGE-------------------5 CHANGE

*Added to Archive/Services - Site Admin

[coppinpr]

Yes, that's it, the original wild duce reel set. Now that you have reel three correct there are only 5 changes there. Are these sold in a 7 strip set as shown? If so, you simply cut the spare strips to make overlays for the corrections. You might want to adjust the wild bells as your mech will probably not be running the wild deuce set up.

[vince55]

Yes they are sold as a seven strip set, when I asked them they said it was so they could be altered to suit.
I'm ordering them today, will keep you updated.
Thanks for all your help.

[vince55]

Well the strips turned up and they look great, but now I have the correct combination I found that some of the payouts are incorrect.

The 1 cherry is correct at 2p
The 2 cherry is sometimes right paying 6p but sometimes only pays 4p
The 3 Bars is correct paying 10p

The 3 Oranges pays 10p and not the 8p that its meant to
The 3 Bells pays nothing
The 3 Plums only pays 2p

The other combinations haven't come up yet so I'm not sure how they are.

Any help you can give me would be great.

[treefrog]

A maybe obvious question: before you started this, did the machine payout incorrectly in the beginning?

I am guessing your machine may have five slides, each the same size, for the coin in question. Are you sure this is a 1p machine as this can cause incorrect payouts? Also note there was a recent change on the award plate. Also, you may find the slight tolerance variances between the steel penny post-1987 and copper ones could cause the 4p 6p issue. The other issues may be either wrong strip to wins or something sticking.

[vince55]

Thanks TF when I started this the machine had totally wrong strips so I was unaware if it was paying out correctly or not. I am sure the strips are correct now I have checked through them six times to check and double check.
It does have five payout slides but it is a new penny machine not an old one, I haven't got brave enough to remove them to check the exact size.

[treefrog]

Thanks TF when I started this the machine had totally wrong strips so I was unaware if it was paying out correctly or not. I am sure the strips are correct now I have checked through them six times to check and double check.

I guess this is why I am asking, as operators often heavily modified machines at the time of decimalisation, so may have changed the payout discs to accommodate. Suspect this would have been the first thing before starting to have confirmed as it would have been strange for someone to change to be useless.

It does have five payout slides but it is a new penny machine not an old one. I haven't got brave enough to remove them to check the exact size.

I am not talking about old large pennies but the new penny which changed material from copper to steel. There was a very marginal difference in thickness

I would take the slides out, clean and check operation. As mentioned many times on the site, just use fine wire wool, maybe some white spirit, to clean and no oiling.

Also when a large win like Bells comes up and does not pay, check the vertical fingers have gone all the way through the three discs or have access to. If holes are there, but it stops part way through, there may need to be further adjustment on timing or lubrication etc.

[coppinpr]

As Tom says, the first key to check is the three bells. As you double checked the payouts before even getting the strips it shouldn't be the case, but check that when three bells show the three holes on the payout disc are actually in front of the vertical finger at all, let alone not going all the way through.

Also, have to ask, how did you line up the reel strips? I'm sure you have them right but simply lining up any three bars at the position where the jackpot finger is doesn't mean the strips are in the right place. It needs to the RIGHT three bars. I'm sure this is not the case, but best to check the none mechanical possibilities first before looking at the hardware.

Also as TF says, the coins can make a big difference. Obviously this machine was not made as a 1np machine. Are you sure it's not a 6d machine pretending to be 1np? Poor conversions sometimes relied on changing as little as possible or later owners just started using 1np because it's a current coin (I prefer to see all these machines running on 6d, a nice coin, the 1np is a naff coin and winning 8np is hardly a thrill).

If you do need to move on to the mech for a cure, the slide clean is a must do first.

If it does turn out to be a 6d machine and you want people to pay to play so they can get a better feel for it you might try the method I use: I have a Beaver gum ball dispenser a third full of 6d's (impossible to fill, you need too many). People can put 20p in the Beaver and get a handful of 6d's to play the machines with.

[vince55]

Thank you both for all your advice. I will keep you updated.

[aristomatic]

Firstly, easy stuff:

Check your coins. As TF says, there are different thickness versions of 1 new penny. Reverse of coin shows different pictures of the queen. If you stack 10 coins high of the earliest coin versus the most recent, then 10 of the oldest equates approx to 9 recent.

If you only put older coins through, then at least all your slide investigations will be the same.
2 cherries pays out sometimes 4 or sometimes 6, this is unlikely due to thickness variation on new pennies.

I would want to ascertain slide info first. If there are 5 slides, are they same? Which coin fits? And check there are 5 corresponding horizontal fingers that release the slides.

A picture of the mechanism out of the cabinet, taken from the handle side showing side of slides and the horizontal fingers behind the slides would be useful in the first instance.

If your new reel-strips symbol layout matches the reel bundle configuration, then I would be confident that your payout fix is a combination of vertical/horizontal finger interaction and some new springs.

GP