Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

American, British, French or German? We want to know about it.
Post Reply
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

Post by stevemaxted »

Hi,
I have promised to sell my Charles Ahrens 2 player Greyhound and my Polo to a collector friend.
I wondered if anyone else can find the date of the steel case?
Obviously it was intended for outside pier use and think I have seen similar in very old photos.
I cannot find that familiar case anywhere on google searches. Would be good if anyone has photos of the same.
I have owned these machines for decades.
Thanks, Steve
Attachments
IMG_3561a.jpg
IMG_3561a.jpg (253.03 KiB) Viewed 2143 times
User avatar
treefrog
Posts: 4826
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 2:46 pm
Reaction score: 33
Location: Suffolk

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by treefrog »

The case style is the same as the football version, of which a few have come up, including the rotten Spicers' one. Also many other game variants. Lovely looking machine. Not seen a greyhound. The date given on another site is 1930, which most of their games are in this area, of this type.
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by stevemaxted »

Thanks for the info, very interesting.
Yes, the greyhound stadium inside is in great cosmetic condition and I cannot find one with this oval track.
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by stevemaxted »

If you open the menu/museum /multiplayer then search ‘greyhound’ at the top, the 2nd selection shows photos of Ahrens Greyhound Racer, 1925.
The case is different and has a slide in coin entry. Not like mine!
User avatar
treefrog
Posts: 4826
Joined: Mon Sep 29, 2008 2:46 pm
Reaction score: 33
Location: Suffolk

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by treefrog »

Always forget to look in the museum… Looks like a tall cabinet version. Most of the other variants are like yours, like the below Blow Ball.

You can see the diamond in the tall one behind the later greyhound paint job. Also both are missing the coin return at the bottom.

ImageImage
pennymachines
Site Admin
Posts: 6650
Joined: Wed Nov 06, 2002 12:12 am
Reaction score: 59
Location: The Black Country

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by pennymachines »

These two images from page 140 of Nic Costa's Automatic Pleasures show Ahrens Steer A Boat in the typical metal case and a Huntsmans Derby which (apart from being in the wooden case) appears to be almost identical to your Greyhound Racer.
Attachments
Ahrens2.jpg
Ahrens2.jpg (171.98 KiB) Viewed 2019 times
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by stevemaxted »

Wow, thanks a lot for finding that.
I have that Costa book so will look it up. Yes, the same steel case and colouring.
I also have the top frame for the marque on the top. The struts to attach are still there.
By coincidence, the wooden Ahrens case shown in the book is similar to my Polo. Same case, stored that for decades too, so certainly not a later copy etc. Here is mine. Obviously the centre knob is a temporary replacement as was broken.

Also regarding the Huntsmans Derby that looks so similar to me saying it is a Greyhound stadium? It is only 2 days ago, when I got access to the steel Ahrens, deep in my garage and it was getting dark. Could not remember for sure but thought I could see a greyhound on the track. I will check tomorrow for sure. Otherwise, maybe it is a Huntsman. So many machines owned for decades!
Attachments
IMG_3569.jpeg
IMG_3569.jpeg (1.85 MiB) Viewed 1983 times
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by stevemaxted »

Will check closer tomorrow but this is a pic taken 2 days ago when I delved into my Ahrens steel case.
Was pretty dim but looks like a greyhound?
What do you think?
Attachments
IMG_3572.jpeg
IMG_3572.jpeg (949.97 KiB) Viewed 1981 times
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by stevemaxted »

Hi tree frog,
Thanks also for the photos. The Blow Ball is certainly that case, very helpful.

Yes, money pinching operators disabled the payout on that on the Polo.
However the parts are all there inside to reattach.
Just needs the payout cup or slide to source.
cheers,
Steve
pennymachines
Site Admin
Posts: 6650
Joined: Wed Nov 06, 2002 12:12 am
Reaction score: 59
Location: The Black Country

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by pennymachines »

stevemaxted wrote: Fri Dec 08, 2023 5:40 pm What do you think?
I think it's the same in all but name. The backdrop looks distinctly rural, whereas greyhound race tracks, which became popular in the 1920s, are urban. 'Huntsmans Derby' suggests the earlier, rural pursuit of hare coursing, which consisted of only two greyhounds chasing a hare.

What is the game play here? I assume opponents race the greyhounds, but what controls the hare?
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by stevemaxted »

Hi pennymachines and all,
Latest info. As I said at the start, I had not looked at my Ahrens, steel case for 20-30 years in the garage.
A dim lit look at it certainly looked like greyhounds, as you can see by the pic sent previous.
Well, I did cast some doubt so opened the garage today with a decent torch and guess what? I can clearly see that the track has horses with a rider!!! Sorry for the confusion, should have looked better before jumping the gun.
The good thing is, that I agree with ‘penny machines’ that the rural scene on the back and the pastoral, countryside figures and furniture inside the track, would not be a greyhound racer as a stark track, showing in your museum pics.
So a HUNTSMANS DERBY sounds and looks more like my Ahrens.
So does that Ahrens wooden case in Costa’s book, ‘Huntsman’s Derby’ be a horse game? or can that name be interchangeable, as you said, it could easily use greyhounds for coursing with the same name.
However, there is no facility for a hare, but it would easily be able to take off horses and change for greyhounds. Just a bolt or two.
Ahrens history is searching, I cannot find any mention regarding Huntsman’s Derby being with horses or greyhounds?
I will have to assume that the Derby name with horses is correct unless I hear different.
Some pics taken today attached, Need to clean up the old dust etc on the track and figures etc. not done yet but all the paint shows no peeling or fading so should come up sparkling.
Thanks so much for helping with the conundrum
Attachments
IMG_3588.jpeg
IMG_3588.jpeg (420.37 KiB) Viewed 1716 times
IMG_3577.jpeg
IMG_3577.jpeg (267.98 KiB) Viewed 1716 times
IMG_3582.jpeg
IMG_3582.jpeg (1.61 MiB) Viewed 1716 times
IMG_3586.jpeg
IMG_3586.jpeg (1.75 MiB) Viewed 1716 times
pennymachines
Site Admin
Posts: 6650
Joined: Wed Nov 06, 2002 12:12 am
Reaction score: 59
Location: The Black Country

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by pennymachines »

Well, the horse-mounted hunters and other figures, plus the pastoral scene all seem consistent with 'Huntsmans Derby', so perhaps 'greyhound racing' and 'hare coursing' were red herrings.
stevemaxted
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Mar 31, 2005 8:26 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Greyhound 2 Player - date etc.

Post by stevemaxted »

Yes, the horse mounted hunters certainly seal the stamp with ‘Huntsman’s Derby.
Always good that question marks are resolved helping with the history of makers like Charles Ahrens.

Glad I am back on pennymachines after a long pause.
So many avid, genuine collectors !!YIPPEE!!
cait001
Posts: 351
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:33 am
Reaction score: 1
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

Post by cait001 »

I'm quite excited this thread popped up. I was sifting through Automatic Pleasures today and noticed the Huntsmans Derby and came online to learn more about it.

I think I've identified a Japanese machine that was a copy / based on Huntsman Derby and/or Greyhound Derby
pennymachines
Site Admin
Posts: 6650
Joined: Wed Nov 06, 2002 12:12 am
Reaction score: 59
Location: The Black Country

Re: Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

Post by pennymachines »

That would be interesting to see... :)
cait001
Posts: 351
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:33 am
Reaction score: 1
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

Post by cait001 »

Here is a link: https://earlyarcadesjapan.blogspot.com/ ... letop.html
I have copied the images from this thread for the post to showcase the similarities. Even though the single image is of poor quality, there are many parallels that point to Ahrens' machines as being the design inspiration.
User avatar
coppinpr
Posts: 5139
Joined: Sun Oct 10, 2010 2:01 pm
Reaction score: 27
Location: Lewes, East Sussex
Contact:

Re: Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

Post by coppinpr »

What a shame it wasn't a hare coursing theme. It would have been something a little different in its day and hare coursing was a VERY popular sport in those days. The Grand National horse race was invented as an additional attraction for the large crowds attending the nearby hare coursing equivalent of the Derby the "Waterloo cup". Of course the dogs don't run around a track in hare coursing but the background scenery would have looked the part.
cait001
Posts: 351
Joined: Mon Jun 18, 2018 1:33 am
Reaction score: 1
Location: Canada
Contact:

Re: Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

Post by cait001 »

Adding it here so it's seen in the thread:
~1937 日本大競馬場 (Japan big racecourse) [卓上競馬機 (tabletop horse racing machine)] by 日本娯楽機製作所 (Japan Amusement Machine Manufacturing)
日本大競馬場 (Japan big racecourse) [卓上競馬機 (tabletop horse racing machine)] by 日本娯楽機製作所 (Japan Amusement Machine Manufacturing) 1.jpg
日本大競馬場 (Japan big racecourse) [卓上競馬機 (tabletop horse racing machine)] by 日本娯楽機製作所 (Japan Amusement Machine Manufacturing) 1.jpg (123.13 KiB) Viewed 1239 times

dionise
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2024 8:28 am
Reaction score: 0

Re: Ahrens Huntsmans Derby identified

Post by dionise »

It's really intriguing to delve into the history and details of the Ahrens Greyhound and Polo machines. The steel case does hint at an outdoor or pier usage, which adds a layer of historical interest. The information about the Huntsman's Derby and its similarity to your Greyhound machine is quite fascinating. It's amazing how these old machines can tell stories about their era. Looking forward to hearing more about your findings, especially about the game play and any distinctive features you uncover upon closer inspection!
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 15 guests