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malcymal
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Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby malcymal » Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:48 pm

From across the pond, never seen anything like this before !!! A Mills Futurity
http://cgi.ebay.com/mills-futurity-anti ... 1|294%3A50

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operator bell
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby operator bell » Fri Apr 24, 2009 3:33 am

I've seen a couple of Futurities recently, at live auctions where I could touch and prod. It is indeed an ingenious mechanism. If you go ten pulls without a winner, it gives you ten coins back. But this hardly ever happens...

It's a 20 stop mechanism, but with 10 stop starwheels, so you can only ever hit half the symbols. Normally these give an extremely conservative game (30%). However, on the 4th and 10th games the frame holding stop arms moves down half a position, so on those games you hit the alternate set of symbols (200%) that have very many cherries and a better than 75% chance of hitting a '2' payoff. It's probably where they got the idea for those bloody British pub machines where the bonus game gets stuck just under the jackpot position for about ten pounds worth of plays, then you hit a 20p winner and it resets.

Pace made their own version of this, called the Kitty. It had a small window on the front counting the losing plays, instead of a big dial. There was one in last year's spring VCA auction.

malcymal
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby malcymal » Fri Apr 24, 2009 8:11 am

Operator Bell wrote:I've seen a couple of Futurities recently, at live auctions where I could touch and prod. It is indeed an ingenious mechanism. If you go ten pulls without a winner, it gives you ten coins back. But this hardly ever happens...

It's a 20 stop mechanism, but with 10 stop starwheels, so you can only ever hit half the symbols. Normally these give an extremely conservative game (30%). However, on the 4th and 10th games the frame holding stop arms moves down half a position, so on those games you hit the alternate set of symbols (200%) that have very many cherries and a better than 75% chance of hitting a '2' payoff. It's probably where they got the idea for those bloody British pub machines where the bonus game gets stuck just under the jackpot position for about ten pounds worth of plays, then you hit a 20p winner and it resets.

Pace made their own version of this, called the Kitty. It had a small window on the front counting the losing plays, instead of a big dial. There was one in last year's spring VCA auction.
Excellent info OB, thanks for this !! :cool:

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daveslot
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby daveslot » Wed Apr 29, 2009 7:10 pm

There is another Mills cheating bandit - a small number of Horsehead Bonus machines had a similar layout to the Futurity making it hard to hit a bonus letter.

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mills
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby mills » Mon Dec 14, 2009 4:59 pm

daveslot wrote:There is another Mills cheating bandit - a small number of Horsehead Bonus machines had a similar layout to the Futurity making it hard to hit a bonus letter.
Right !! .... and wrong !!
You can see the probabilities of this machine (first model of Mills Horse Head Bonus) on my web page : http://www.joiret.com/slot/Mills/bonus/proba_BONUS.php

quadibloc
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby quadibloc » Wed Jan 15, 2020 6:51 am

The Mills Futurity certainly would seem to qualify as a rigged slot machine.
Usually, it works as a 10-stop machine, paying out only about 20% of the money that comes in. On two of the ten spins as the meter moves towards refunding the player's money, however, it gives back twice as much money as is played... mostly in prizes less than ten coins.
Yet despite that, if you include that 10-coin return at the end of the sequence, its payout percentage is actually not that bad.
At least I think so: in my page on slot machines, http://www.quadibloc.com/math/sloint.htm I have attempted to calculate the winning percentage for both the basic Mills Futurity and the Mills Gold Award Futurity.

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coppinpr
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby coppinpr » Wed Jan 15, 2020 9:48 am

There is one thing that confuses this issue... Mills made a set of cams for the 10 stop (20 symbol) machines that the operator could change to adjust the payouts, probably used in much the same way as modern slots are key operated to offer bigger payouts on certain days (never play slots on cruise ships other than on the first and second days and the last day :lol: ), although in those days the change was most likely made every few months, not every few days.

quadibloc
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby quadibloc » Wed Jan 15, 2020 5:43 pm

Incidentally, although I had previously seen the French site that documented the Mills Bonus machine, the URL in the post above mine for it is no longer valid. I've added, therefore, more detail to what was a brief description of the Mills Bonus to my own page.

And now I've updated the page further to add what you've told me about the cams.

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brigham
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby brigham » Thu Jan 16, 2020 9:22 am

Thanks for the explanation of the early BONUS 10/20 system.
I knew early ones had the dual mech., but I never knew why.
I had come to the conclusion that they were simply using-up existing FUTURITY mechs..

quadibloc
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Re: Mills Futurity - A cheating Mills Bandit?

Postby quadibloc » Fri Jan 24, 2020 2:43 am

I see it wasn't mentioned in this thread yet: the reason for the dual 10-stop arrangement on the early Mills BONUS machines was simply so that players would have to wait 10 spins before getting BONUS at least, instead of getting it in five spins if they were very lucky. However, since the chance of getting a letter from the set B-O-N-U-S was changed from 25% in every spin to 50% in half the spins, and zero in the other half, the long term average chance of getting a letter wasn't changed.

Since the chance of getting the five letters in order in just five spins was very small, either Mills realized the risk of being considered to be cheating wasn't worth it, or it was just because the fancy mechanism was a waste of money.

But if other cams, that change the ratio between the two groups of ten stops, can be put in, since the stops without the letters also don't pay as much back, that would make the machine's percentage easily adjustible. It would be the only slot machine for which the myth of a screw for adjusting the percentage was close to true.


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