Aristocrat Olympic 'Wheelie' reel alignment & restoration

[maestro66uk]

Topic moved - Site Admin.

Hi all,

Having just amended my profile on here, and also adding an "introduce yourself" message, allow me to tell you about a machine I've recently purchased, and also the ONE problem I now have with it.

I have recently bought an Aristocrat Olympic "one armed bandit"

Aristocrat Olympic "Wheelie"

As you can see, it needs a bit of TLC. Let me tell you that the machine looks nothing like that at the moment!
It has all been thoroughly stripped down, the chrome parts are now at the platers being cleaned, prepped and re-chromed.
The whole mechanism has been totally stripped, de-greased, rebuilt and is running better than it did before! (reels 1 & 2 spun fine but reel 3 slowed down and stopped before the brake kicked in - all reels and brakes now work just fine).

The problem I'm having is with the reel alignment / payouts.
I think I've got the reels aligned properly but I'm doubting myself.
You can't go wrong with reel 3 as the payout disc is attached to it full time - so we know the jackpot symbol is correct on the win-line.
Are the jackpot holes in the discs near the centre hub or the outside edge? Should one finger only be going through the jackpot hole, or a few fingers through a few holes too??
I have read all the threads on this forum associated with payouts, reel alignment, discs but none of them seem to help me.
I also read about a manufacturers alignment hole in the discs? Someone stuck a wooden rod through this hole to help align the reels (I saw the photos). I will shortly be going back into the garage to work on the machine again today and I want to resolve this damn problem with your help.
I think I've got reel 1 aligned as when a cherry stops on the win-line, the finger is going through the disc, it is kicking the slider out of the way but the slider is flying back into place and stopping the payout slider - yes it happens really fast.

When I stripped all the mech, I made sure that the disc fingers, the bottom sliders, and payout sliders were all removed and kept in order - so I know they're all back in the correct positions.
This issue is driving me nuts, so hopefully by joining this forum the problem should be solved in no time!

[coppinpr]

Welcome to the forum. We can fix this problem, but first we need to be sure what the problem is. Before we can look at the reel alignment, it would seem that it's not paying at all. Check that you have the five clicks when you cycle the machine. The first three are the reels stopping; the next is when the vertical fingers fly forward hitting the payout disc; the last is the when the clock operated stop retracts and the slides all attempt to return to their start positions. Is this final click there? If not, the the slide stop is not engaging during wind up. Can't remember if Aristocrats have a factory alignment hole. I can't check because I'm sitting at Gatwick waiting for a 3 hour delayed flight to Istanbul.

Your other questions:
As far as I can see from the photo, this machine has no jackpot. What it does have is a criss cross feature. This means that fingers from each reel will need to go through holes to pay. If it is strictly reel 2 middle and reels 1 and 3 top or bottom there will be 1 hole in 2 and 2 holes in reels 1 and 3. If it's "anywhere in the window", there will be the holes in each reel usually cut as one large slot in each disc.

[maestro66uk]

Hi coppinpr,

Thanks for the quick response.
Ok, to answer your questions - yes there are 5 clicks. Everything is working as it should do.
There is only ONE "BAR" jackpot symbol on reels 2 & 3, there are 2 "BAR" symbols on reel 1.
The jackpot payout is a massive (wait for it) 30p !! lol......this is for 3 BARs across the winline. (this is a 2p play machine)

[coppinpr]

Ok, now it's clearer. I could be wrong, but Aristomatic will be along later I'm sure and he will know for sure, but I think this machine is a UK conversion. I've not seen it before. What I suspect happens is the machine 20 for the 26 criss cross, anywhere in the window payout plus an additional 10 if the win is straight across the middle. It could be the 30 has its own payout holes, but it would be even more complex than it already is for such a low pay machine. More photos please, then we can sort it.

[maestro66uk]

Hmmmm.....now you've raised a very valid point there about the long slots in the discs - yes there are long slots, but only one set if I remember rightly - I mean near the centre hub and just one line of them, which means that only ONE finger could pass through them. I will report back when I've been back into the garage to have another look at it, and I'll also get photo's of the discs, fingers and sliders too.

The machine was working fine before I stripped it down - well apart from a slow reel 3.
I'm confident we'll have this niggle resolved in no time.

[aristomatic]

Afternoon and welcome to the forum, and congratulations on your first purchase. Great first machine. Firstly, do not be concerned as you will be up and running well before the platers are finished! So take your time. Great that you have read all the previous threads etc.

My partner is poorly, so am just back to the hospital, but am sure others can sort you out just as quick. If not, I'll post tonight with info to sort you out. Don't forget to take payout tray out and give it to the platers to polish too.

Regards
GP

[maestro66uk]

Thanks, aristomatic.

Hope your partner gets well soon, and thanks for getting involved with this little problem.
I've not been into the garage yet (I'm a lazy sod today).

Yes.......the cast alloy payout tray is also with the platers, it's going to be bead blasted and polished!
I will upload photo's of the refurb of the machine when all the chrome is back on it. We've taken lots of photo's of the process, so there'll be some great "before" and "after" shots, as well as mech strip-down.

[aristomatic]

Hello again,

I have had a few Wheelie version Aristocrat machines over the years. You do have to remember that the reel bundle could have undergone a whole raft of changes for different award and graphic combinations, but you want it to pay out as per the current setup, so hopefully we can sort that out pretty quickly.

Firstly, I'm no good at manipulating pictures with arrows etc. but, bearing in mind where you have got to already, I think you should still work it all out from these. This is the way I do it - others may well have better ideas.

On Aristocrats, the jackpot and/or feature symbols tend to be controlled by the vertical fingers (e.g. metal levers that go through the holes to trigger the slide release for payouts), towards the front of the machine, and other payouts, e.g. cherries, oranges, plums, bells are controlled by the vertical fingers towards the rear of the machine.

Usually, the 'anywhere in the window' lower award will be controlled by one vertical finger and the higher award by another. The revolving steel plates have the holes drilled into them and the plate closest to the vertical lever is reel one, the centre steel plate is reel 2 and the plate furthest away from the vertical fingers is reel 3.

Does your mechanism have a lever at the front centre base, located just to the right of the chrome diagonal overflow tube (when looking at the front that is)?

Here's a few pictures of one of my mechs. Let me know about the lever and are you familiar with it?

Here is the lever

[maestro66uk]

Hi again aristomatic,

Thanks for the details about the fingers and sliders etc. Thanks also for supplying the pics.

Yes, I'm very familiar with the entire workings of the machine, and I have used the "stop the clock" lever to pause the operation of the mech.
I was playing about with the mech again earlier today. When I lined up the 3 "BAR" symbols across the winline, then released the clock to continue the cycle of the mechanism, I noticed that the finger on the left (as you look at the payout discs) went straight through all 3 discs (this hole is an elongated hole made up of 3 seperate holes).
The mechamism did its usual stuff but instead of ALL the payout sliders being released, it only released the bottom 5 and left the top slider (biggest one) pushed back. Now for a 3 BAR win right across the winline, this should've released ALL payout sliders.
I conducted an experiment and positioned the BAR's in multiple positions across the '27 ways' configuration and the payout remained the same - just the bottom 5 payout sliders shot forwards. (see these pics)

3 BARs across winline

'27 ways' BAR win (test)

I decided to conduct a little experiment/test, and swapped the left upright finger with the 2nd upright finger - the second finger has no cut-out gap in it like all the other fingers have. (see these pics)

With payout fingers in place

Cut-outs in upright fingers

I positoned the 3 BARs across the winline and ran the mech again - this time ALL the payout sliders shot back. Unfortunately, when I tried the '27 ways' experiment again, the payout sliders all shot back - so that test didn't work, so I swapped the upright fingers back to their orignal positions.
I also noticed that a cherry on reel 1 should pay out 4p - none of the payout sliders are allowed to move back to drop the winnings (this should be the bottom slider only which slides back).
I looked at the disc (disc 1 = reel 1) and saw that the finger wasn't quite through the hole (see this pic)

Finger not quite through the payout hole on one cherry, reel 1

I can only assume that the reels are out of alignment but how can this be when the disc on reel 3 cannot be moved as its riveted to the reel? I assume reels 1 and 2 are to blame?
Onwards and upwards we go - what do you suggest we try next?

**Amendment to posting**
Having just "previewed" this posting before I let it go live, I looked at the pics and saw that the two top BARs in the '27 ways' are not within the win window! But the payouts still paid out after I swapped the 2 fingers.
The solution will be staring me right in the face but I just cannot see the wood for the trees!

[iggis]

I had a similar problem with some winning combos not paying out (Jennings governor). The problem turned out to be reel alignment. On investigation, the vertical finger was binding on one of the slots in the disc. A minor reel realignment sorted it. The jackpot also had a problem which was also easily sorted, the lower finger was binding on its payout slide. Some careful filing of the lower finger had this fixed too. Thanks too all the posters on here, we are all learning the tricks to maintain these great machines.

[maestro66uk]

I've gone to bed every night dreaming about this bloody reel mech! lol
Yes, really!

I'm gonna have another crack at it again today. The more I step away from it and think about things, the clearer things become.
I assume the far left finger drops through the elongated holes (set of 3 holes drilled next to / into each other on all 3 discs) to pay out the '27 ways to win' - which means that the second finger (the one with no cut-out gap) should fall into ONE hole in all 3 discs when all 3 BAR's are across the winline? It's got to be that!
So by aligning this lot, it should also put the basic 1 cherry win on reel 1 back into line. I shall investigate further and get back to you.

[humperdingle]

Daft question... But have the reel strips been replaced over time?

And are the strips matching all the payout slot cutouts?

[maestro66uk]

The reel strips are glued on. The machine paid out just fine when I first bought it - albeit instead of paying out an 8p win it would spit out 6p - I just put this down to things being dirty, and not been cleaned or serviced for years.

I had to take the reel mech apart to give it all a good clean.
Since reassembling it I'm now having problems with payouts.

[aristomatic]

OK, morning and thanks for the pictures. If you have replaced the vertical fingers to their original positions then vertical finger closest to front (1 with the cutout) controls the 27 ways bars payout ONLY. The vertical finger, second from the front (1 without cutout) controls the jackpot bars centre line ONLY, e.g. 3 bars scattered above the centre or below the payline, then only the finger closest to the front will trigger the lower payout. 3 bars on the centre line will trigger BOTH of the front levers. As the 2nd lever has no cutout, this combination will trip all slides and make the higher (jackpot) payout as it releases all the slides including the top slide too.

Of course, it's easier to get bars scattered the 27 ways, so the payout award is less (e.g. the top slide is not triggered). It's a lot harder to get 3 bars on the centre line only, so the payout award is higher (2nd lever trips the top slide too).

The other vertical levers front to rear:
bars 27 ways
bars jackpot
bells
plums
oranges
cherries (This lever is different as it controls both 1 and also 2 cherry payouts. We will get to that later.)

Before we continue, it's clear from your pictures of the non-payout on cherries, but also the front on pictures, that the reels are not aligned correctly. If you look at your front on picture, and look at the 3 revolving steel plates, each plate is notched for each symbol and, if the reels were correctly aligned, then those notches would also be aligned (in a horizontal straight line with each other). From your picture, looking from the front, the notches on the plates to the left and right are higher to a different degree to that of the centre plate. This will be the underlying reason why the missed cherry picture shows the furthest back vertical lever missing hole.

We also need to understand that the vertical levers (upon a payout) have to find a corresponding hole in the closest steel plate first, then the centre steel plate, then the furthest away steel plate. This is where a lot of inexperienced people become confused, as they see the 3 steel plates, WRONGLY, in the same order as the reels with the symbols on (e.g. left plate is left reel, centre plate is centre reel and right plate is right reel). As the machine is cycled, the left symbol reel stops first. This corresponds to the right side plate (closest to the fingers), then the centre symbol reel stops (which is centre plate), finally the right symbol reel stops (left steel plate).

Firstly, you need to cycle the machine and pull the clock fan lever forward (never discussed earlier). Remember to pull this lever forward, before any of the reel stops come forward, to stop the reels. The reels and steel plates will now be free to be manually moved to any position. You need to just move the left symbol reel forwards and backwards. As you do this, the steel plate closest to the vertical fingers should move in tandem. If you look at the 27 ways vertical finger (e.g. the one closest to the front), as you rotate, you will see that there will be three slots cut in the steel plate that straddle the finger position. This is to allow the finger to go through a hole, even if the bar is above or below the win line.

If you continue to rotate the plate but look at the 2nd vertical finger position, you will see that there will be a SINGLE slot only for this jackpot lever to go through, when the bar is on centre line only. This single slot will be in line horizontally and to the right of the middle slot cutout for the 27 ways lever. As 2 bars on the left symbol reel there will be (hopefully) 2 sets of these 3 slots to pay 27 ways and 2 corresponding single slots for the jackpot lever.

Still with me?
As you say, the reel symbol 3 steel plate is fixed. Reel symbols 1 and or 2 could either have been re-tightened incorrectly, or they could be just loose and not have been tightened fully and then worked themselves out of place as you have then cycled the machine. They could be slightly out, or miles out. The jackpot vertical lever (e.g. 2nd from the front) is where we need to concentrate.

Now remove the springs off the top of all the other vertical fingers, except the jackpot finger. Now loosen the two retaining screws on the left and centre symbol reels sprockets (e.g. accessed via a socket extension between the left and centre and the centre and right reels). Once these are loosened, cycle the machine and pull the clock fan lever forward, then manually rotate the closest steel plate to the fingers till 1 of the single slots is directly in front of the jackpot finger, then hold the steel plate in place with one hand at the same time with the other hand releasing the clock fan lever. Hopefully, the cycle will end and the spring on the jackpot finger will force its way through the hole on the plate closest to it. You may have to do this a couple of times, as it can be a bit fiddly.

Once you are happy that the finger has gone through the hole on the first plate, we now have to rotate the centre steel plate one position at a time, till the jackpot finger goes through the corresponding hole in the centre steel plate. As it's tensioned by the spring, it should do this on its own. However, if the spring is poor, it may need some pressure applied.

Once you are sure the jackpot finger is through the hole in the centre plate, you can rotate the 3rd plate (as this reel is fixed you will have to lift the reel stop lever off the sprocket at front of the 3rd reel). As you rotate this, eventually the jackpot finger will find the corresponding hole and force its way through and trip the slides.

The third symbol reel, as it's fixed, should now show the bar on the win line (hopefully). As there's only 1 bar on the middle symbol reel, just align the bar onto the winline, then re-tighten the screws.
NB, be VERY careful, as it's easy to split the alloy casing if you re-tighten them too much. Hopefully now you have the bar showing on the winline on both the centre and the right symbol reels.

As there are more than 1 bar on the left symbol reel, you need to be more careful with this reel, before assuming that this reel is correctly set for all the other payouts, e.g. cherries/oranges/plums. The 2 bar symbols on this reel will normally be spaced unevenly, so if you look at the steel plate closest to the vertical fingers, then the jackpot finger position will have its corresponding single slots the same corresponding spacing apart. So if you match these up correctly, you will know both bars are in correct position and all minor awards will be in correct position too.

If you cannot understand this part, you can just align one of the bars and re-tighten, replace springs and check the minor awards. If the minor awards don't pay correctly, you need to repeat the 1st symbol alignment to the other bar symbol.

Others will chime in if it's not clear, or I can help later tonight or tomorrow morning.

The single cherry lever, by the way, pays both the 2 coin (4p) and the 4 coin (8p) payout. It's because the lowest tip of this vertical finger is oddly shaped.
1 cherry payout: the vertical finger only goes through the first steel plate releasing bottom the 2 coin slide
2 cherry payout: the vertical finger goes through both the 1st & 2nd steel plates, as the finger moves further inwards.
At the top it also has a further movement in the opposite direction at lowest tip of the finger, thus enabling this oddly shaped end to trip both the lowest 2 coin slide and another 2 coin above, paying a total of 4 coins (8p).

Hope all helps. Have to dash.

GP

[maestro66uk]

Hi again aristomatic.

Thank you for taking the time to type that full explanation.
Your explanation makes perfect sense, it's as clear as glass.
I haven't been in the garage yet to have another play with the reel mech, but I've been thinking about this problem all morning!
I thought along the very same lines as your instructions!!

So thank you once again for this invaluable advice, I'm going to go back into the garage shortly and set to work on it again........hopefully today will be the day that we resolve this niggling problem. I have good vibes about today!

*ding* ding* - seconds out - round three!

[aristomatic]

Looking at my previous post, it looks more like clear as mud... I am glad you got the general gist of it. Hopefully, you will get all sorted soon. I'll have check in late tonight and tomorrow - hopefully you will have had chance to sort.
One other thing - don't forget that when re-tightening reel sprocket screws that you leave a little space between each of the reel drums so that they don't catch/snag on each other.

GP

[maestro66uk]

Ok, update time.
I've been in the garage for the past few hours twiddling with the mech.
I have now SORTED the issue!
The symbols on reels 1 & 2 were just slightly out of alignment.
The '27 ways' works and pays out as it should. The jackpot works and pays out as it should.

But........

Running a dry test with other symbols, I found a few discrepencies.......
A 3 orange winline paid nothing out!! Investigating this I found the problem. Reel 3 !! Some of the holes in the reel 3 payout disc are just slightly out of line. Sometimes the oranges pay out, sometimes they don't. To investigate this further I tested all the oranges on reel 3 and found one orange (hole) is just a milimeter or so out of line - the finger won't go through the hole - it's right on the edge of it.
Any advice on why this could be? After all, the machine worked fine before the strip-down (or so I think).
Also 1 cherry on reel 1 is NOT paying out (4p win - bottom payout slider should shoot forward to drop 4p but it doesn't). The finger goes through the reel disc 1 hole without snags and hits reel disc 2.
2 cherries (reels 1 & 2) pays out 8p as it should.

I can't see how any of the vertical fingers can possibly move the bottom payout finger.
The far right upright finger pushes out the two bottom payout fingers. So how does a one cherry win work?? I can't see any logic behind this.
Here is a pic of the bottom of the vertical fingers again for reference:

Bottom of vertical payout fingers with payout fingers removed

See what I mean about the far right vertical finger being able to push out the bottom two payout fingers?

Any help on this 1 cherry problem would be much appreciated.

[coppinpr]

Aristomatic will sort it quicker than I can. Enough to say 1 cherry payouts almost always use a different system on all machines.

[aristomatic]

Hi good to see that things are moving forward, at least on the 27 ways and the jackpot pays.

Ref. cherries situation, I think I have confused myself, which is not too difficult in the current situation. I think you are going to need an additional vertical finger to trigger the single cherry payout.

The vertical finger is currently tripping the 2 cherry payout by going through the first 2 steel plates. I will also go through the first steel plate when only 1 cherry is on the win-line but the number 1 slide payout at the bottom tip of that vertical finger doesn't reach the lowest slide to trip it (WHICH IS CORRECT).
If you look at the bank of horizontal levers (which release the slides when pushed back by the vertical levers), you will see that the lowest one is slightly different in shape to the ones above it.

Let me explain better. If you look at the lowest tip of the vertical lever for the 2 cherry payout, where it strikes the second from the bottom horizontal lever - well, look at the bottom horizontal lever, just to the right of where the 2 cherry vertical lever strikes. You will see (hopefully) that the bottom horizontal lever has a wider depth here than the lever above it. If you cycle the machine, and set up a single cherry on the pay-line, you will see (hopefully) that the vertical lever for the 2 cherry pay goes through only the first plate (which is correct), and doesn't trip any of the horizontal levers to trip any payout (which is correct).

If you now look at the closest steel plate, just to the right of the 2 cherry payout vertical lever, there will (hopefully) be a payout cut out slot horizontally in line with the 2 cherry payout lever, and directly in line with a currently empty vertical lever position. If you put an additional vertical lever in that empty slot it will, on a 1 cherry payout win-line, go through that slot at the top and trigger a 2 coin/1 slide payout at the bottom. The lever will only go forward a small amount at the top (i.e. through the closest steel plate only) but, because the lowest horizontal lever is wider where it strikes at the bottom, it's sufficient enough to trip the bottom slide.

It is easy to see these cherry payout slot holes if you just cycle and stop the fan and rotate the 1st symbol reel and you will see the exact cut outs for any cherries on the closest steel plate next to each other. What's difficult to see is the next bit, but it's not a problem (hopefully) but defines the 1 slide to 2 slide payout. Although the closest steel plate has holes side by side for both 1 and 2 cherry vertical levers, the central steel plate ONLY has cutouts for the 2 cherry payout, so only the 2 cherry lever can go through the centre steel plate. So when you fit the additional vertical lever for the 1 cherry payout, this lever will only go though the closest steel plate, as there are no corresponding holes in front of this lever in the centre steel plate, so it only travels enough to trip the bottom slide to pay 2 coins (1 slide). The vertical lever you currently have, e.g. the 2 cherry payout, goes through the first steel plate when 1 cherry is on the pay-line, but cannot trip its 4 coins (2 slides) until two cherries are on the win-line, by travelling further at the top and bottom positions.

Hope that makes sense.
Come back to me tomorrow if it doesn't.
(To check, you could move the current 2 cherry lever to 1 cherry, then you can check it).
You still need an additional lever. I will see if I have a spare if you don't have one, but it will be the weekend at the earliest.

GP

[maestro66uk]

Hi again aristomatic, and thanks again for the help.

Again, your description makes sense to me.
I will have a good look at the bottom horizontal finger to see if it tapers wider at the pin/spring end.
Like I said, when I first got this machine, it was all working fine - even the one cherry win.
I just don't understand what's caused it to throw a bit of a strop now it's all been cleaned.
I hear what you say about the other 1 cherry holes in disc 1 being cut right next to the 1/2 cherry holes - I've seen them.
if I have to fit another vertical finger, then so be it. I just can't figure out why it's suddenly stopped working on a 1 cherry win.

Also the 3 oranges issue - disc 3 is the culprit here, we're talking about 2 millimetres out of alignment on one hole - again, I assume it worked fine for years, so why is starting to be a pain now? I assume the manufacture would've cut the hole so the vertical finger goes through the CENTRE of it, and not the lower edge of it.

Weird.