EH / Collector Connector sales

[raj]

Without wishing to cast any doubt about the validity of the SH auction, as I was not in attendance, there are many ways to rig either an ebay sale or a live auction to suck in a genuine bidder to pay over the odds. Shill bidding is one way, in which the owner bids against their own item to raise the price to its reserve. Often, once a second real bidder comes in, the shill bidder will withdraw the bid either during or after the auction, leaving a 'Second Chance' option available to the unsuspecting punter. Ebay are very quick to spot this & WILL jump on you & possibly prosecute people involved. Look for bidding history & see what % has gone against the seller, it may be a clue.

An old trick is to use a fuzzy photo of something deliberately to disguise flaws, e.g. shot chrome, or manipulate the picture to make sure flaws are hidden, for example the fact there are only 3 symbols on 3 reels, the rest being missing or damaged. Using pictures of a similar but better item, or library picture to get a sale is quite common, as is adding disclaimers to descriptions half way through an auction, e.g. spares only.

The usual 'selling for a friend' found in granddad's loft, 'I don't know much about these' etc. should be well known by now.

Another method is at a live auction, when the auctioneer will bid 'against the chandelier', in other words, a non existent person, or a plant in the audience, again to suck in a new bidder, who will 'win' the item at an inflated price.
As for items sold on ebay, it is very easy for an item to appear to be sold for any amount of money, 100s or 1000s more than the real value by using a couple of ebay IDs not obviously connected. After the sale has completed, the buyer then raises an online dispute with the seller, and they agree to cancel the sale. It only costs the entry fee, all commission is returned and there is now a history of a 'rare' machine being sold for an untrue price. The same happened during the '80s with classic cars, when bent auctioneers actually created a completely hyped market for old cars, which then gained a life of its own, making the early punters very rich. Obviously, the market eventually crashed, leaving buyers with cars they could never get a decent price for.

I'm not sure about the legality of not declaring an item has not reached reserve, but normally the auctioneer will say something to the effect of 'sorry', or be more specific, 'see us after the auction'. To state something is sold when it is not is underhand if nothing else.
Anyway, I hope I have not given anyone ideas, but in a small forum like this, word soon gets around who are the good guys & who aren't.

[badpenny]

Two little ploys I have witnessed in the past which have amused me at live auctions are.......
1) Opening with a low start and when half a dozen hands go up the auctioneer levels a rapid £20 increase on each one. This means the bloke at the end of the line with his mouth agape with surprise raised his hand for the opening bid of £50 and discovers he has just been taken for £120 ........... nice

2) Dropping the hammer and then immediately re-opening the bidding because a hand went up late. Woo Hoo !!!RANT!!

Oh yes we've seen it all.

Mistakes happen, but one auctioneer in particular was very fond of the above two, within minutes of each other

[JC]

Is she still doing it, do you know?

[badpenny]

Can't say, as I've not frequented that auction.

I prefer warm venues with toilets, food and drinks available and a free car park just outside the door.

[treefrog]

No news as to whether these auctions can keep up once every quarter as the website has not posted any lots yet for Sept 4th, when the previous auctions were online more the two weeks prior to the auction.

The first auction there were definately some bargains, less the case second time round. One bandit I regretted not bidding on at the time was a Mills Castle Front, including commision sold for £462, last week it sold on enay for £822 There some was something not quite right and I cannot remember what it was, certainly the escalator had been chopped.....anyway someone got a killing..

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/110730270700? ... 1423.l2648

[treefrog]

Interesting, after posting yesterday's comments about the Elephant house auction, the website had been updated and it is cancelled... looking forward to Coventry.

[christopheb]

Mills Castle Front (...) There some was something not quite right and I cannot remember what it was, certainly the escalator had been chopped...

FYI : also, the Castle Front was missing the jackpot mechanism. The description did not mention anything about this, but I noticed on the pictures that the jackpot window had been painted over, so I asked the seller, and he kindly confirmed.

I really wish I did live in the UK and was able to attend one of these auctions !... Eday is fun, but nothing like the real thing ! (and the prices !!!).

[coin-op]

FYI : also, the Castle Front was missing the jackpot mechanism. The description did not mention anything about this, but I noticed on the pictures that the jackpot window had been painted over, so I asked the seller, and he kindly confirmed.

I think that with Mills old penny bandits in the UK, the jackpots are generally missing...but people, correct me if I'm wrong!

[christopheb]

Yes, I think I read that somewhere else in this forum too. Was that not due to some law/regulation about the maximum amount which a machine was allowed to pay out ?

That's sad, because a bandit without its original jackpot is... well... It makes this beautiful machine somewhat less desirable (to me, at least)...

[treefrog]

It's not difficult finding jackpots, the issue is getting one that will handle large old pennies. Not seen one on a British conversion of these older Mills machines. Also as stated the reason they were converted was the legal gaing requirement, so the jackpot would have affected this. I do have a old Jennings Peacock on 1D with fully working jackpot. What is interesting with Jennings machines, the British variants often have coloured number reels instead of fruits, I have never understood this, anyone know the reason?